Help with ordering new set up

[JAKRider]

The folks at Bomberonline suggested I post for help. Back 10 years ago my board was set up by others more knowledgeable than I as shown in the attached pictures. I made some minor adjustments early on but nothing for years. I like it the way it is but think I should order new boots and bindings since my gear is aging and replacement on the hill is non-existent where I ride. I plan on ordering the TD3 step-in set up and 225T boot but I don't know technically how to order the same set up cant/heel plate that I have. I'm assuming this has something or everything to do with the 0/3/6 degrees question on the front and rear disk. I currently ride with a cant/heel plate in the back and nothing up front. I also don't know if I should order soft (yellow) or medium (blue) rings. I am not an aggressive rider. Sadly, I look like a skier on a snowboard. I do not lay it down. Any guidance would be greatly appreciated before I make the investment.

[Chris Houghton]

I'm sure that others far more knowledgeable than me will chime in soon, but that looks like a 7 degree Burton rear cant/lift. Easy enough to replicate with TD3's, the 6 should be close enough. Others can recommend which rings to buy, probably the blue would work well if you're a heavier rider. The bindings look to be set up pigeon-toed, or is that just the camera? Usually the rear binding is 3 to 6 degrees less angle than the front. If you did this intentionally, then ignore the comment. So - TD3's and 225's, what about a newer board too?

[Jonny]

Nothing wrong with looking like a skier on a snowboard, but with that setup you have almost no choice unless you're super committed. The stance appears to be very narrow and pigeon-toed. Coupled with the huge rear cant you've pretty much got to stay at home over the middle of the board and do all your turning with hip/waist-angulation. Not so bad heelside but very little power toeside, and it takes perfect technique and good snow to avoid losing all your angulation and breaking at the waist.

Honestly, I'd start over. Find the thread which suggests stance widths based on inseam and start there, with a moderate cant on the rear (this is one of the reasons why I like Cateks, solid though TDs are in every other respect) and a decent stance width and no worse than equal angles, and experience the joy of having a back knee with you on the dancefloor. Then tweak from there...

[Pat Donnelly]

And where do you ride?

I am nearby and can help you next season . . . Pine Knob is my home base.

[GV27]

Well, some people are naturally pigeon toed, and in that case those angles might make sense. I'm naturally very duck-footed, to I run a pretty big difference in angles - 45 front, 20 rear. As Jonny said, no shame in looking like a skier on a board. My skier friends say that about me - it's a compliment.

Let me ask a question - in the second picture, I see a board with bindings and a pair of boots. Are those boots just sitting there, or are those your feet in there while taking the picture? I suspect the latter, and if so you're probably not pigeon-toed. I'm guessing you're just standing there naturally not thinking about your feet and concentrating on getting a good picture of the board, right? If so, the way you have your bindings setup your legs are probably fighting each other and there goes all your power.

I'd like to say that since you have a 7 deg cant in the back and none in the front that you should just order a zero up front and a 6 deg out back. That may still be where you end up. But with your angles as they are and the fact you're not really happy with the current setup it's hard to say for sure.

As for elastomers, I'd go for the softs. The TD-3 is going to be WAY stiffer than those old Burtons and if your boots are super old the relatively soft 225s will probably be a bit stiffer than what you have now, so go with the softs just to get used to them. You can always buy firmer elastomers later if you change your mind. Same goes for the cant discs for that matter.

So I think Jonny's right. You seem a bit lost on your setup, so find the thread (I can't find it off hand, but I'm sure someone can link to it) and start from scratch with that. You can always go back to what you have now.

You've made solid equipment choices so you have two choices: either figure out your stance with what you have before you order, or go ahead and order new equipment with an educated guess knowing that you may have to order some other accessories later. I think a 6deg rear cant and soft elastomers would be a good place to start.

Think about how you feel, but new equipment just might free you up mentally to really explore a new stance.

Either way, be prepared to do a lot of experimenting. I find it helpful to try both middle-of-the-road options, and wacky angles too just to see how it feels at the extreme. Take a screwdriver to the hill with you, so if you really hate one setup and can't ride it, you can just change it rather than having your day ruined. For example, try a very duck-footed stance. Try really slack angles (forgetting about boot drag temporarily - this is just an exercise). You already have a pretty extreme pigeon-toed setup so you know how that feels. Try moving your stance far to the rear or to the front. Try really narrow stances and really wide stances. Then move back to a more moderate stance and dial it in how you want it. I only do an exercise like this every few years, but I've found it a good way to explore different options and nail down what really works for me.

edit: oh, it's hard to tell with the snow, but that might be the adjustable cant disk. Yeah, I think it is. Anyway, 7 deg is close and to directly answer your tech question, yeah - it has everything to do with the 0/3/6 question. The TD3 discs are more flexible than that plate, but the 6 degree is what you want to replicate what you have there in the back. And a 0 for the front.

Chris

[tpalka]

If binding stiffness is an issue, you can also get the Ibex binding with the 7* cant -- Fin sells them -- and you'd be closer to your current setup too.

[Donek]

Unless you are over 190 lbs, I'd go with the yellow/soft e-rings. I'd get 0/6 cants or possibly move to 3/3. Then I'd go to SES, ECES or a local session and ride with other carvers. Listen to first hand advise and get some direction on hill. Your riding will improve dramatically and you'll find help in adjusting your stance to work more effectively. SES and ECES will have board demos available, so you can try a new board too. There are typically very qualified instructors and industry reps on hand to help you.

[LambertoMI]

Sean above has the best point of view on this. Riding with others and talking about your riding is the best way to develop your skills.

Your bindings and board are very similar to what I also ride, and I have no issue with the outdated technology. I will probably get a new board soon as the older primes like yours an mine are outdated compared to new boards and materials.

SES is a great place to test drive some of these newer boards. But bindings and boots while improved a lot, might not be that noticeable. Perhaps next season we should do a SES in michigan. I am based at Brighton.

L-

[BlueB]

First, you didn't tell us how heavy are you? If light weight (and we already know non-aggressive), the TD3 SI will feel infinitelly stiffer then the plastic-fantastic Burtons you've got now. Those are probably the softest bindings around. I would definitelly replace them, with something more reliable. F2, Snowpro, Ibex, used Race Plates...

If heavier, yes, go for TD2/3, by all means. I'd go with yellow elastomer and standard bails (no love for step-ins here). Consider ordering them with 6/0 cants and an EXTRA 3* cant, then you'll have plenty of options to play with.

You already have the SB series boots, looking at that pic. 225 will not differ much. I wouldn't bother replacing the boots, unless they are falling appart or have cracks. Maybe just replace the liners, old ones must have packed over the years, add BTS. If you ended up with step-ins, you still can replace the heels...

The cant disk you've got seems to be a Burton Uni-Cant. With the max setting, it would be 7*. However, we do not know where it was set. A bit of toe lift is essencial for me to prevent the quad burn and to increase the stance width, but we are all different.

Is the board an old Ulta Prime, or Factory Prime? UPs are actually good learning boards, especially for EC. Some of the FPs are stiff bastards.

Boards have changed the most over the last 6-7 years... Easier to ride and better performing... Try to go to an event (SES) where you can demo lots of stuff, before buying a new one blindly. However, odds are that you'll like a new school board better, even without trying it first...

[queequeg]

Unless you are over 190 lbs, I'd go with the yellow/soft e-rings. I'd get 0/6 cants or possibly move to 3/3. Then I'd go to SES, ECES or a local session and ride with other carvers. Listen to first hand advise and get some direction on hill. Your riding will improve dramatically and you'll find help in adjusting your stance to work more effectively. SES and ECES will have board demos available, so you can try a new board too. There are typically very qualified instructors and industry reps on hand to help you.

+1

Yes - if you can, come to either of the sessions (or both!). This will get you in touch with current carving technique, technology and riders. You can probably learn enough in just a few days at any session to get you started with improving your technique, and it will make narrowing board/binding choices down a lot easier so that you can choose a setup that is right for you with confidence that you are moving in the right direction.