Buck Hill Summer Skiing

[bobble]

Second run I stopped to cool off. I moved the board and it felt like it was stuck to the plastic.  I felt the edges and i felt bumps. Took the board off and holy crao. The edge melted. 

I spoke to the owner. He stopped to ask how it went. I showed him. Told him I'm not upset and I support the cause. He said that they're going to work on a sprinkler system next week. 

Hard for me to see if photos show the damage on cell. 

 

 

 

 

Edited October 8, 2016 by bobble

[bobble]

more details... last evening i took only two runs. 

before first run i saw the new owner at the chairlift. he was talking to an employee that was just setting up a water station at the chair. he had asked if i had taken a run yet. i said no. i talked to him about the previous night on how the rain made a big difference with edge temps and how incredibly fast it was. i also asked him about the lubricant because i have it all over my gear and clothing. i have to wipe down board before putting it in my car else it slides around. i also have to towel off my hands before driving else it gets onto the steering wheel. he said it's a non-toxic silicone based material. 

first run, i felt some slop in my front binding so i took it easy getting down the run. the Neveplast felt rougher (more frictive?) compared to previous night/rain.  i felt the metal edges and they were very hot. went to car. it took about 10 minutes to resolve the binding issue. when i got back to the lift the metal edges felt cool. by the time i reached the top, 15 minutes had gone by since last run.

the second run, skidded at the top. in the middle i tried cutting across the fall line. when i got below the knoll i slowed down and tried to set an edge for toe-side carve. up until then its been loud scraping sound. when i set the edge it got quiet. the board sped up a bit but then i felt a rubbing sensation. similar to rubbing a finger on glass. i lost speed. went directly to the lift. 

i stood at the lift for a couple minutes waiting for the board to cool. as i stood there i moved the board and it felt like the board was stuck to the Neveplast. i reached down and felt bumps on toe-side edge. took the board off and ... wut? 

ok... so maybe the Elan isn't sintered? 

while walking back to my car, i encountered the owner at the clock tower. the owner warily asked me again how it was and i showed him the damage. he was very apologetic. i said that i support their efforts and hoped they can make this work. he thanked me for my patience and said that they were working hard to fix the problems. 

as he was examining my board, a bystander with rental skis approached and started talking to us. the bystander said that he's seen that problem too on the rental skis and that he's gone through a couple sets of them. the owner said to the guy "seriously?". 

the owner said to me that sometime next week that they're meeting with a company to install a sprinkling system. the sprinklers would be in certain zones and would be intermittent. i told him i had contacted two board manufacturers and Donek recommended installing a sprinkling system but even with the sprinkling system, the boards were still getting damaged.

guess i'm going to rent but i thought the rental gear had sintered bases.

 

[DonPablo]

Rune any of Buckhills boards yet Bob? I wonder what generates more heat, being on edge carving, sliding on an edge, or bombing straight down the hill. Maybe if you wear the base off you could start your wood core on fire.

[bobble]

5 hours ago, DonPablo said:

Rune any of Buckhills boards yet Bob? I wonder what generates more heat, being on edge carving, sliding on an edge, or bombing straight down the hill. Maybe if you wear the base off you could start your wood core on fire.

i haven't been out riding. busy with stuff; family and work.

re: burning... you oughta talk to the guy in the rental shop. i wish i had my phone to record his theories. they've had a full spectrum of equipment/riders to analyze. the more experienced riders seem to have less damaged equipment. he used terms like "edge modulation" and "side pressure". apparently the experienced skiers are able to modulate their turns. also said to have sharp 90/90 edges. dull edges creates friction. 

buck is suppose to be installing sprinklers but i haven't check to see if progress has been made.

check out the video. moira and i were there just checking out the run. ok, truth be told -- we went to the waffle bar. who wouldn't?

anyways, we appear in left frame at about 0:17. we were there and saw we these guys with gopros. so everyone go out and give them that bomber-love.

but despite the happy video, he posts this to bucks instagram. 

 

i've watched the video a few times. suspect the video poster doesn't know how to turn modulate edge pressure.

 

[snowboardfast]

The pureboarding guys in Japan are riding on slpoes like this with hardboots and a Pureboarding board that has a metal layer on the base to prevent melting . The slope is wet . They are laying out turns in pureboarding style. I don't recall where I found this video? I think they had joerg build them a board for this type of slope?The metal layer looked like aluminum to me and was right next to the edge and went in a ways on the base. I would think you would need this and a wet surface to prevent board damage and sticking? 

[bobble]

On 10/21/2016 at 0:51 AM, snowboardfast said:

The pureboarding guys in Japan are riding on slpoes like this with hardboots and a Pureboarding board that has a metal layer on the base to prevent melting . The slope is wet . They are laying out turns in pureboarding style. I don't recall where I found this video? I think they had joerg build them a board for this type of slope?The metal layer looked like aluminum to me and was right next to the edge and went in a ways on the base. I would think you would need this and a wet surface to prevent board damage and sticking? 

someone from Buck Hill showed me a photo of a board with metal strips embedded into the base. i thought the person showing me the photo said it was a Salomon board. i tried searching for images/videos online of people from japan carving on Neveplast. only video i saw were some guys that had alpine boards. 

rented a snowboard today. had issues with the stance width. very narrow. felt like an accident waiting to happen.  with the narrow stance and Neveplast, it took effort to make the turns. on occasion i had to swing my arms, when i reached the bottom and needed to transition from toe to heal, i had to jump up and kick out the rear foot. there's something about the Neveplast that when you get below a certain speed its really dicey to make turns. 

buck has sprinklers installed. they're on timers.  i don't know how long they're on.  they also have a tub where you could ski up and into it. i didn't see anyone using it. i don't think it works well for snowboards because its awkward stepping into it.

i had talked to a skier who was inspecting his skis. he said with the sprinklers, his skis were holding up. 

some pictures of the rental. i didn't inspect the board before i grabbed it so i don't know if the damage was from today. the damage below was on rear toe-side edge. there was also damage to front heel-side but not as bad as the rear. the edges didn't feel hot at all.

 

 

[bobble]

tried again. rented another board (#5401). inspected the edges and they looked good. no wear or tear.

between runs i made sure that i stomped the edges on the lube bad. i also dunked the board in the tub at the lift. i tried to ride where i saw the sprinklers running.

4th run i noticed something off when taking heel-side turn. i felt like board wanted to slightly pivot around the front boot. took the board off and the front boot heel-side edge was chewed up. i suck.

the sprinklers were running but i'm not sure if they're turned on long enough. the wind was gusting and so the spray from the sprinklers on skiers right looked like the water was blowing back onto the grass. there were other areas that were watered down enough for the skiers to kick up a small spray.

i rode mostly from center to skiers right of the run. the ski teams had a course set up on skiers left.

the rental shop guy asked how it went and i showed him the damage. as i was leaving a kid showed up with rental skis and said the edge was coming off and wanted another ski.

[Pat Donnelly]

May have to go back to hard wood bases with screwed on metal edges?

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

I wonder how this product can be successful if the result of using it is so much damage.  Doesn't pencil? 

[TLN]

May be owners of that hill doing something wrong? They have to water it, or lube it to prevent such things.

[DonPablo]

It's lubbed, and they added a sprinkler system. I would like to think Nevaplast did some kind of inspection and hand holding process during the installation, I'm sure enough money was spent on it...

[bobble]

buck hill has been taking steps to mitigate the problems they've encountered. they have been lubricating the run but as everyone discovered the lube alone wasn't enough. i heard that they were applying it twice a day. the reason this dry slope material was chosen was because the owners were told by Neveplast company that water wasn't required. they now have installed sprinklers too. 

so i don't know what more they could possibly do. everyone needs to adjust expectations because this isn't snow.

some damage could be attributed to the riders' skill.  i'm at around 212 lbs so the weight all on one edge might be a factor too. 

i might try skiing on it this weekend but i really suck at skis. (hint-hint: randy)

[DonPablo]

Did you make it out on the ski's? I've had a really busy month with work and helping my mom get my parents house ready to sell. My dad took a job with American Honda and he's been out in California for training. At the end of year my parents will be living in Texas.

I've been watching the recent videos added on this forum and I feel like I've forgotten how to snowboard... It's been so long.

[bobble]

Not been to buck on skis. I've been busy myself. Had a little bit of drama that me preoccupied past couple weeks. It's all good. I'll save it for the chairlift. 

[DonPablo]

Buck start making snow? I was driving down Normandale and I could see the guns running at Highland. Powder Ridge started making snow too.

[DonPablo]

Looks like crossroads and milk run are open, but I don't know what the grooming the is like. Might be kinda springish conditions.

Edit: I might go out Saturday morning

Edited November 23, 2016 by DonPablo

[bobble]

37 minutes ago, DonPablo said:

Looks like crossroads and milk run are open, but I don't know what the grooming the is like. Might be kinda springish conditions.

Edit: I might go out Saturday morning

I haven't been very motivated to go boarding. Monday I mounted soft boot bindings. They still had some of that lube on them. 

Yesterday it was heavy sleet. Definitely demotivated. 

Might try Friday. 

[DonPablo]

I might go out tomorrow morning but I have to take Darby to the vet at 9 first. Got the MK waxed this morning, need to do some scrapping tonight.

[DonPablo]

Guessing you're gone or skipped out Bob. You're not missing out on much, spring like conditions, the snow is soft, flat light. Just walking in my boots I would drop down about 4 inches in the snow. I took one run, buried my nose with out any effort. They haven't been grooming because it's been too warm. They put the Nevaplast on the loading/get off of the lifts ;( 

 

[bobble]

i left around 10:30. yep, it sucked. i think if i rode softies it would've been better.

i'll be out saturday morning. hope the temps are cold enough to groom but its really thin. someone carved their snowboard and their edge penetrated all the way down to the grass.

[bobble]

buck is changing the layout of neveplast. 

 

last season they had the neveplast on Milkrun -- a run that is used for Nastar and Ski Challenge. they're moving it over to Teachers Pet -- the beginner run which is very slow at the top with stepped pitch.

i am curious as to how this will play out with the public. i'm guessing the ski teams will not be pleased for a variety of reasons; slow run, constricted path around trees, inconsistent pitch, etc. 

on other hand it might draw out more people who were intimidated by the neveplast on a racing run. ... and being closer to the bar is a plus.

aside from the board damage, riding on neveplast is very humbling. forget carving on a snowboard. its skidding all the way down. its not the same as snow.  however, you can carve with ski's on it but you have to be committed ... to damaging your gear. 

might give it another try but on rentals. opens in june.

[BobD]

On 4/29/2017 at 7:48 AM, bobble said:

buck is changing the layout of neveplast. 

l'm guessing the ski teams will not be pleased for a variety of reasons; slow run, constricted path around trees, inconsistent pitch, etc. 

 

Given that carving at higher speeds on Milk Run is what is damaging bases, this makes sense. There may not be so many training drills for snowboarding on Teacher's Pet, but for the skiing, it's very different. Many advanced ski and race training drills are best done at lower speeds.

Is there a way to edit out links and images from quoted post?

Edited May 3, 2017 by BobD

[bobble]

@BobD not sure how to disable linking.

the slower hill will help but i hope they install sprinklers. and lots of them.

the ramp off the chair is longer than milkrun. getting off the chair at milkrun was somewhat intimidating on neveplast. hard to explain. so much lube. board slips around, difficult to edge. I usually held onto the chair for stability and to prevent going off the edge of neveplast. might be more of an issue with teachers pet going down the ramp one foot in binding.

i wouldn't be surprised if they moved some of the park features over to teachers pet. 

[Scott.Creer]

Their air bag game is old now. Progression airbag is where it is at. 

 

[DonPablo]

That is cool, definitely a major step up from the old air bags. Would probably get more interest than the current air bag that seems under whelming at Buck and sketchy with the near quarter pipe kicker.