Why can't I stick a toeside?

[Justin A.]

My heelsides are uber powerful and killer, but I can't hold a toeside turn worth a damn. Its really frustrating. The tail of the board always washes out mid turn and I have a hard time getting it back. What can I do to help this?

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[ar(angel]

I'd say make sure you're staying inclinated and keeping edge pressure throughout the turn. My weakness (among many) are my heelsides and I've found that in comparison to my toesides I initiate my toesides much earlier than my heelsides and I don't inclinate myself enough. When throwing a toeside I get the board up on edge early and drive harder from just before until right after the apex of my carves. On my heelsides I don't do any of that, I just kind of "ride it out". Watching video of myself this season has helped me immensely and I'm slowly figuring out what it is I'm doing wrong and finding ways to correct it. Even static shots help to identify your weak spots. Another trick Trikerdad taught me was to slowly work your way down the hill doing a series of just toeside or heelside turns depending on what you're working on. Start with fairly shallow turns and ride them until you fall over. With each successive turn deepen your lean and inclination until you feel you've reach the point you are comfortable with. Thanks to Ralann for all the time and patience he's had this season with taking video & pic's of me. I've made some of my best turns ever this season due to being able to analyze my riding.

[bobdea]

toesides go all to hell.

maybe post a video or pic and someone can help you out.

or you could describe exactly what you feel

[ar(angel]

I found this season when I tried to steepen my angles after receiving the Virus (17.2cm waist), my ability to control my edges went away severely. Let us know your spec's (binding settings, boots, etc.) and that might help.

[Justin A.]

Its a Coiler 184 PRII, Head Stratos Pro boots, Cateks and Ive got about 63/60 angles. It feels like I just can't hold the edge on the toeside. Kinda like Im leaning forward too far, which I probally am. I'll be up at Bretton Woods this coming weekend (fri-sun) and I'll try to get some pictures and video. Be even better if I had someone to ride with who sucks less than I do .

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Savanna

[snow|3oarder]

I had the same problem and when i got a little lower on the board, made sure i was more upright...thereby putting more wieght on the back leg....it started to work better. but i tend to break at the waist sometimes.

[Gleb]

I was able to get my toeside down by putting my boots in walk mode. It kinda let me use my ankles to drive the board into the snow. Also, maybe you're straightening your rear leg too much.

I wanted to get a video of me riding all season, but never got around to it :-\

[trikerdad]

Try playing with the cant on your back foot to give you more toe side bias (leaning your leg toward your heel). The Catek's should make it very easy to try.

[bobdea]

I would say the first thing to try is to drop the angles

looking at that pic in your avatar it looks like you have under hang

with a 28.5 raichle I can get on a board with a 18.8 waist and run 58/55 with absolutly no drag

many people run angles higher than they need to and it can cripple your riding to some extent

[Gleb]

He is right. I used to ride 69/65 and i thought i was doing aright. Bob reccommended that i drop them a few times but the moment i dropped my angles, it felt really weird, like i was riding from the back seat. But after a little bit, i defintly became much more efficient in my carves. I ride 63/60 now, maybe lower...to lazy to check right now. I got long ways to go though.

[bobdea]

those boards are crazy narrow, the fornicator loves ice, take care of the PTC tune thats on it, maybe send it back there for a tune or something

high angles work for some but don't for many thats why I generally say to go lower if you can if you are at or above 60

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Again and again and again I see riders "Reaching" on their toe-side. Even though they often don't think they are. Typically I find folks favor the toeside yet it is often the weak side. Some of this is due to perception or fear of falling over backwards. Without seeing photos or videos it is impossible to know for sure. Odds are you are leaning, reaching and or breaking forward at the waist removing the pressure from the edge. Attempt to stay "Centered" and overcompensate in the week directiong. Meaning? if you tend to be too forward, then force yourself rear ward.

One of my favor "Examples" or "Visuals" of staying centered.

We have all seen a Carasel , picture the pole that goes through the horsey!

It starts at your head , through your shoulders, spine , hips and mounts right between your boots on the board. You are forced to travel alone the pole!

This is obviously not consistant with a number of alpine styles. Just one vision aid for the more up right stance styles.

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

For some good imagery?

Noticed how both mean are "Stacked" over the board in a line?

One somewhat relaxed and the other more intense , both smooth and balanced.

My 2 cents.

You have the right idea. Hook up with other riders , hang with those you wish to emulate. RIDE, RIDE , RIDE, You will get better much faster with miles on the mountain.

[Justin A.]

The underhang in the avatar picture is a trick of the angle. I was sitting on a snowbank waiting for my friends and I got bored and started taking pictures, so that picture is taken a little bit off angle from the true angle of the binding. From above, the boot edges are right over the board edges. The wierd thing is that I've never had a problem like this before...Maybe it was the conditions or something. I dont know...someone come up to Bretton woods this weekend and help me? If nothing else I'll try to get some video while Im up there.

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[RicHard]

For some good imagery?

Wow! Just for curiosity: who is the rider on the 15th? It seems to be a known rider, to me.

[ar(angel]

He came by and rode with Rob and I about a week or two ago and he is definitely one of the "smoothest" riders I've seen. Trikerdad also moves very effortlessly on his board, almost like his upper body is stationary while his legs just glide back and forth underneath him. Bryan rides this way too, but with arms in more of a "gunfighter" position. Ralann has become very "symmetrical" this season, carving equally as good on his toesides as on his heelsides, he's almost a completely different rider than from last season. This just proves to me that through hard work and adjustments you're riding style can change. Riding with others is a HUGE help, something I hope to do more of next season. I'm not much different than I was at the end of last season, but I'm working on it!

[Justin A.]

After riding this weekend on a shorter board, I discovered the problem. I wasn't driving my back knee down enough, and then coulpled with my tendancy to lean too far forward (on the board, not breaking at the waist) keeps the toesides from having any power. I think my biggest problem though is seeing the ground come up at my face, on a heelside I can't see it ;). I did manage to get some video, but none of it is very good, so it probally isn't even worth my time to post it, but I will.

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[patmoore]

After riding this weekend on a shorter board, I discovered the problem. I wasn't driving my back knee down enough, and then coulpled with my tendancy to lean too far forward (on the board, not breaking at the waist) keeps the toesides from having any power. I think my biggest problem though is seeing the ground come up at my face, on a heelside I can't see it ;). I did manage to get some video, but none of it is very good, so it probally isn't even worth my time to post it, but I will.

Independently I reached the same conclusion. I was very comfortable on heelside turns but seemed to be struggling with toe sides. When I made a concious effort to force the rear foot to do some work, the edge engaged much more smoothly.

Now the season's over! :( :( :(

[Gleb]

where did u ride justin?

[Justin A.]

I was up at bretton woods for the weekend. Poured on friday afternoon which was good because it firmed the snow up, then it snowed a bit over night. The wet snow also froze overnight, making for some AWESOME conditions saturday morning. Snow stayed good and firm almost all day saturday, then it warmed up a bit overnight. Sunday morning it was still firm enough to have fun, but nothing special. Sunday just kept getting warmer and softer as the day went on, so we bailed around 1'o'clock. I saw someone coming in sunday as we were leaving, he was walking in with a Volkl RennTiger with a female companion(wife maybe?) anyone know who it was? For anyone else that was up there I was the guy in blue on the Yellow Factory Prime that was trenching on the ice all weekend.

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[Gleb]

thats cool. Any snow left in souther NH?

[Maciek]

My heelsides are uber powerful and killer, but I can't hold a toeside turn worth a damn. Its really frustrating. The tail of the board always washes out mid turn and I have a hard time getting it back. What can I do to help this?

Justin,

You have to keep your shoulder up. If you drop it, you will skid the turn with low control and possibly fall.

Do excercise and start on easier slope and at slower speed. When entering toe side turn try to rise your inside arm while lowering outside arm (some even try to grab outer edge of board that actually is off snow). Try to reach invisible bulb or reach to the sky with inside hand.

You can also pretend to be a bird and try to "fly" with your arms stretched sideways. Just never drop the inside arm. In fact your arms should be as much parallel to the slope surface as possible. Do not think about lower body during excercise. Just get a feel as flying bird changing directions downslope. Do not be intimidated by any remarks or comments. Do the excercise. It is life time excercise which may help you to resolve the issue.

I had the same problem for a few years (exteremely strong heel side and extremely poor toe side). I eliminated it by the excercise in a matter of few days. Then I came to race course and got comment from my coach: "what did you do that you are that fast now?" I said that I had my new aerodynamic haircut (that's actualy true). The fact is that I did not skid my toe side in uncontrolled way from that time.

Also make sure that your "back foot" works across the board. Try to keep as low stance angle as possible on that foot and work with foot and knee rather than with hips. Also I agree with one of comments here: you should try to keep the "back boot" at very soft adjustment so you do not try to fight new stance and boot and you could focus on proper body position. What I actually did, and it was times of Raichle SB 225, is I put soft plastic tongue replacing hard one and I put lever to walk position.

Now as you progress with the technique you may stiffen boot a bit to previous setting, but as soon as the problem reoccurs come back and repeat excercise.

I hope it helps a bit.

[NateW]

Some suggestions, from someone who obviously has never seen you ride:

1) Get a bit lower, crouch more. It will help your legs soak up the rough spots. I have a tendency to stand straighter on my toesides, and it makes little problems harder to recover from.

2) Move your stance forward a couple notches and see if that helps. Then move it back a couple and see if THAT helps. The decide if you want to move you stance back and adjust your posture, or just keep your stance in whatever new location works. You could also just adjust your technique to begin with, but this is easier IMO. :)