TD3 SI or TD3 Sidewinders??

[Bora20]

I will be getting new bindings this year. Help me choose.

TD3 SI with Fintec heels with UPZ RC10 boots & Prior 4WD 179

OR

TD3 Sidewinders with UPZ RC10 boots & Prior 4WD 179

Cost is almost identical, which ones should I go with? I had TD2 standards this winter, but clipping in was a bit of a pain, but I am new and will get used to it.

[snowboardfast]

I would go with td3 sidewinders. I switched last month after riding td3 step ins and have no interest at all going back to stepins. The side winder works way better because it softens up the pounding that you can get with plate bindings and hard boots yet it still has good power transmission for carving. Much smoother in choppy snow and all mountain riding. It allows me to ride all day and my legs don't get as tired because of the smoother ride. It smooths out the ride of all my boards. I have tried it on several boards that I own-Nidecker 183 Tornado Donek 172 AX Prior174 4wd. Works well on all of these. I think it really improves the Nidecker. I rode it all day last week in spring conditions and was comfortable. You will notice that these are all glass boards. I haven't bought a metal board yet. Still want to do that at some point. I have ridden Catek Olympic step in td1 step in td2 stepin and td3 step in and like these way better! I have been riding step ins since about 2002 so I have done it a lot. I feel that this is the best binding available right now and I have ridden lots of bindings both bail and step in.

[Bora20]

The issues that I had with the TD2 were that there are no bail stops. A very difficult thing when learning and having short arms. The TD3 fixed this with all models so that should make it easier.

[heroshmero]

I have to admit that I haven't ridden the TD3 Step-ins but this winter I upgraded from TD2 Step-ins to the Sidewinders. You won't be disappointed. They drastically reduced the fatigue that I felt in my knees and ankles after a day of riding. They really are that good.

[energyrail]

except with upz mondo 26's you will be flipping the front bail around to get them to fit loosing the bail stop on the front.

Another problem I think you will have is the rear ledge on the upz is tucked up so far under the heel, that to center the boot on the board lots of adjustment is required. On my catek's and snowpro's my heel adjustment is almost maxed forward in order to center the boot.

Of course one can increase binding angle to eliminate overhang on the heel and have a bunch of clearance on the front. but that's not gonna work for me.

So If I buy some sidewinders, I think i'm gonna run a ski din block on the back to fix this. Does anyone know if the height will change or the lean angle of the boot will change with the different blocks

[bjvircks]

Energyrail

1) the UPZ alpine heel is a bit soft

2) the UPZ DIN heel is same height but rigid

3) the DIN heel I have does not change the way any heel bale engages my UPZ boot

4) the '10-'11 season DIN heel (not on the UPZ page yet) seems to have a heel groove filler which would change where a heel bale would engage.

[Corey]

I'd be HIGHLY suspect of the extended DIN heel on the UPZ boots in snowboard bindings. It adds a whole bunch of extra leverage trying to pry the heel bolts out of the boot. It'll put much more stress on those bolts than an Intec heel does. Stresses in a ski binding are much different and have an upper limit where the binding will release.

You might be fine, you might not. Given what might happen if these bolts fail there's no way I'd ever use the current extension in a snowboard binding.

[WASMAN]

I have heard that the new SW are not ideal for people who ride with higher angles. There is a real delay in initiating the edge because you have to overcome the flex in binding before it transfers energy to board. With lower angles it is not as prominent. Any feedback???

[KingCrimson]

I'd be HIGHLY suspect of the extended DIN heel on the UPZ boots in snowboard bindings. It adds a whole bunch of extra leverage trying to pry the heel bolts out of the boot. It'll put much more stress on those bolts than an Intec heel does. Stresses in a ski binding are much different and have an upper limit where the binding will release.

You might be fine, you might not. Given what might happen if these bolts fail there's no way I'd ever use the current extension in a snowboard binding.

The bail is still sitting on the boot ledge, regardless of what sole you have on it. If this were not the case, the normal heel would be just as bad.

The new heel that we've seen on the ATB is obviously different, but from what I've seen it's still using the boot ledge; it's not a lever hanging off the back.

[Corey]

The bail is still sitting on the boot ledge, regardless of what sole you have on it. If this were not the case, the normal heel would be just as bad.

Screenshots from "UPZ BOOTS 0910A.pdf" that I got from somewhere here on Bomber.

Ski:

Tour:

[energyrail]

The groove one uses to attach the snowboard to the heel. Is the same groove designed to hold the ski din soles onto the boot. the bolts weren't engineered to take the load the ledge was just like the toe. If the bolts are being loaded the boot has already broken.

having said that those screws are kind of a onetime deal. Once they are removed and retightened a few times, They won't want to get as tight. It is good to nut them , and use real threads.

anyway by the looks of the pictures the ski din soles will move the rear bail as much as 2 cm. That would go a long wayin getting them to fit bomber bindings. and the ridigidty of them won't be an issue in the sidewinders.

[Bora20]

I like the looks of the Tour toe/heel pads. Might keep me off my ass on the ice when I am walking. Plus they are a little bit higher off the board.

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

I have heard that the new SW are not ideal for people who ride with higher angles. There is a real delay in initiating the edge because you have to overcome the flex in binding before it transfers energy to board. With lower angles it is not as prominent. Any feedback???

I find this is true. Especially if conditions area really good and firm (calky , excellent firm carving surface) In other words , the harder I can carve the more apparent the absorbtion and release of energy is. It is an interesting trade off. I find on the super good smooth firm days I would prefer the non SW models. When it is rough or less consistent surface I do see the benefits of the SW. The trade off is that I seem to loose some edge angle and as a result the radius of the turn opens up a bit. Currently I am riding with a TD3 SI in front and a TD3 SW SI in back on a TD2 base plate. Both with yellow elastomers.

Keep in mind. I am probably at the far end of the test group , so to speek. At 250lbs and running 70/65 angles on what most consider stiff narrow alpine boards.

[WASMAN]

I find this is true. Especially if conditions area really good and firm (calky , excellent firm carving surface) In other words , the harder I can carve the more apparent the absorbtion and release of energy is. It is an interesting trade off. I find on the super good smooth firm days I would prefer the non SW models. When it is rough or less consistent surface I do see the benefits of the SW. The trade off is that I seem to loose some edge angle and as a result the radius of the turn opens up a bit. Currently I am riding with a TD3 SI in front and a TD3 SW SI in back on a TD2 base plate. Both with yellow elastomers.

Keep in mind. I am probably at the far end of the test group , so to speek. At 250lbs and running 70/65 angles on what most consider stiff narrow alpine boards.

'TD3 SI in front and a TD3 SW SI' - Sidewinder Step in??? did not think there was such a thing yet??

[heroshmero]

'TD3 SI in front and a TD3 SW SI' - Sidewinder Step in??? did not think there was such a thing yet??

oldsnowboards did his own unofficial mod to set up a TD3 SW SI.

http://www.bomberonline.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=29507