Quick Turns?

[Jonny]

I'd love to hear some chatter on approaches to quick slalom type turns, especially on slopes with some pitch.

Perhaps it's just increasing age and girth, but I'm really struggling to get the edge engaged and working on quick linked turns. Its disappointing because my longer GS-type hooks are feeling really good and solid considering how early it is in the season.

I ride a 180 Coiler with a short sidecut- 11.5m or so. I don't aspire to be a Gilmour-style wigglemeister, but I'm sick of sketching on every narrow trail.

[Guest zaphod]

try a shorter board, something like 160 will turn as tight as you dare. or a softer one that you can flex into a tighter radius.

zaphod out...

[Guest Pre School Rider]

are always set-up by the end of your previous turn.If you hesitate,you're too late.If you push too hard,too long,you'll over-arc and run outa room.Lower,looser,more fluid is how it works.Of course,using a shorter and/or softer board will help,too.

[Guest Randy S.]

Check out Jack's Article about cross-under turns. I find this sort of technique helps a lot with quick turns on narrow, steep slopes and chutes. It takes a lot of work, and sometimes requires jump turns if it is really narrow and really steep.

As PSR points out, quick edge-setting is important in setting up for the turn. Also, staying low so you have lots of rebound/recoil in your legs. For us older farts, this gets increasingly difficult. I run out of steam after less than a dozen really hard turns. Usually it opens up a little though, so its OK.

Shorter boards do make it easier, since you are moving less around, but I find my 171 Donek FC1 works well.

Note that I'm describing something different from veideling, I'm talking about quick, short radius turns and jump turns on steeps. Oh, and Jack's Article is much more eloquent about this than I am.

[Guest cmc]

Ive got some new vid clips with some quick turns. Ill wait until I get some more and post them somewhere on the web

[philfell]

With an 11.5 meter side cut you should be able to do some short turns with that board. In order to make quick turns on a longer board you have to be even more dynamic than if you are doing a longer turn on the same board. Try getting a high edge angle earlier in the turn and drive you hips towards the nose of the board in order to bend the tip into the turn quicker. Some time you can also slightly slide the initiation of the turn with your feet then, hook up the edge through the apex ( this is really hard to explain on paper). Hope this helps.

[NateW]

Do you want to make quicker / tighter carving turns, or quick back-and-forth skidding turns?

The only way to get a tighter carve is to get a higher edge angle. More speed helps get more inclination, though it can also mean covering more distance between carves as you switch edges.

For a given speed you can use more angulation (bending your body to get more edge angle). The best tip I've heard so far for angulation has been "drive your knees into the turn." Toeside is pretty straightforward, heelside it helps a lot to have your hips over the back of the board - or should I say it's much harder if your butt moves to the inside of the turn. With your butt out back, you can easily push your knees to the inside, which raises the edge angle, which tightens the carve. This is something you can practice at low-to-moderate speeds and then apply to higher speeds (at least, that's the approach I took when I got a new board with a 30% larger sidecut and had to really work on this).

For skidding turns, I find that it helps to think of my front foot as travelling straight down the fall line, with my back foot swinging back and forth behind me. And it helps to get the board light when changing edges and rotating the board - extend your legs quickly as you finish a turn, and/or suck your legs up quickly as you switch edges.

[jason_watkins]

Originally posted by Randy S.

Note that I'm describing something different from veideling

what the heck is that?

[mtnpig]

Hey, this is a perfect time to mention this. I just came back from a Snow Performance Carve Camp at Sun Peaks B.C (a very well thought out triple peak w/lotsa groomers). It was incredible. We were taught about set up (stance-width/cants/lifts) to help adjust some funky technique/style tendencies you typically pick up in the past year or two. Alot of times you have a trouble spot so you alter something to compensate for it. However you may also just be stapling feathers on your arms (thinking you will soar into the sky) and find they only soften your inevitable impact with Ular's remains. These coaches were right on the money in calling out miniscule adjustments in technique and style to get the job done. Whether it be freecarving or gate training they would help you plan an attack and still maintain some dignity thru out. You could see for yourself (along with alllllllllll the other students) where improvement should be made cuz alot of it was on video. For some it could be a situation of glory or gory. I learned years of development in just days not only from the coaches but the so called "students" were total rippers and stylists. Everyone was supportive and helpful, definitely one of the most satisfying things I have been involved in. The people that attended this camp are what I will never forget. I strongly recommend this camp for learning to carve and just ripping it up.

[Chris Houghton]

Not to get all technical, maybe concentrating on getting more pressure on the nose earlier in the carve will do the trick. I know that steeps usually make people lose some confidence, then lean back a bit, then skidded turns. Can you get the tight turns you want on flatter slopes?

[Jonny]

Thanks guys - I'll get a chance to try all this out in the next few days.

"Wedeln" is the old-timey Tyrolean word for a series of quick linked ski turns, with the tips heading almost straight down the slope and the tails wagging (wedeln in German) back and forth behind - a good way to control speed and pick up chicks if you're riding 215 cm skis with painted bases and no sidecut to speak of. I'm more than old enough to remember when this was the mark of an expert skier.

I'm definitely able to turn this board VERY tightly once I'm at speed, and I do often overcarve myself out of slope. The aggressive move which tips the board up on edge at moderate speeds winds up tipping me on my face when I'm going slowly. It's easy to skid the thing, but I'm looking for linked little carves. I'll have to look again at Jack's "cross-under" but I usually associate that with getting quite a bit of deflection from the fall-line. I look forward to CMC's clips, but would like to have some techniques which work for those of us not made out of silly-putty as well.

I'll start with low and loose, get my butt behind me and initiate forward, and go from there. Thanks again.

[Neil Gendzwill]

For short turns, I find a very dynamic motion works well. Extend your legs hard into the turn, then suck them back under and through into the next turn. Unlike a big-ass carved turn where you commit your whole body to it, this is all leg and knee action here. Keep your upper body quiet and facing down the fall line. I'm basically talking about bump technique, if you're in the bumps it's more a series of edge sets, on groomed you can let the board carve a little longer.

[Guest Jompot]

Hi

Here are two examples of carving when on narrow trails:

http://www.extremecarving.com/films/demos/wmv/virage_push-pull_j.wmv

http://www.extremecarving.com/films/demos/wmv/virage_push-pull.wmv

The first one looks very crossover'ish the second one seems to be doing a little crossunder.

Jompot