Joined the summer carving club.

[Puddy Tat]

Bought my first longboard today.

Landyachtz Bamboo Dropcarve with Bear Grizzly 852 trucks and some Abec 11 BigZig 75mm 81a wheels.

Took it to the street out front and played around. Super fun, I could press into a carve without worrying if the board was going to skid out. I was quickly able to start leaning into the carves and really making it move around. Fun. Feels a little like doing fast ankle based carves. Looking forward to playing with this more this summer.

Now my daughter wants one too.

I need a helmet and some gloves so I can start playing a little on the hills around here.

BTW where do I go for technique advice on carving these things. A lot of what I know seems to apply, I can compress into the carve, and there is some upper body rotation going on, but it feels almost counter-rotational at the moment.

Dave

[Puddy Tat]

I've been out about 4 times in the past couple of weeks. Fortunately I've got a long hill in front of my house (Conner's for anyone familiar with Edmonton). I've figured out how to carve, and today i sucked it up and went to the top and found i can carve my way down the hill without to much difficulty and I'm starting to get more comfortable carrying a bit of speed in a carve. The counterotational feeling I mentioned before seems to be gone.

I picked up a helmet before i went onto anything that resembled a hill, and the other day i picked up some skate shoes and slide gloves to protect my hands for when I eventually bail. Today i started from the top, carving from one side of the road to the other, just keeping my speed under control. After a couple of runs I was able to carry more speed in the carve and the rear trucks with 81a wheels started skidding out. Maybe I've got my weight to far forward? Also on the last run my comfort level went way up and my turns got tighter, i let my weight sink down, and I was doing what felt like cross-under carves where I would suck the board back to me. I don't know if that makes any sense because the board isn't attached to my feet so I don't know if technically that's correct. Anyways it felt great and I was able to keep my speed under control.

So questions,

1. How do I deal with speed wobble? Any time I pick-up speed and am straightlining the rear truck starts wobbling around, making me nervous as hell. Do I change to a stiffer rear bushing? Can I run with different bushings front and rear?

2. How do I learn to slide for speed control? This foot braking from speed, or even worse from a speed wobble, is a little nerve wracking, takes a huge distance, and is hard on the shoes.

I'm liking this it's just tough learning from scratch by myself.

[BlueB]

Right on!

First, get some knee and elbow pads too, you'll scrape, sooner or later...

Speed wobble

When it happens, I like to "suck up" the board a bit, like sink a bit in the knees, for lighter touch of the feet. Good part of the wobbles is rider overreacting at the initial disturbance.

Also, try to dewedge the rear truck by 2 Khiro soft wedges - about 15*. Yes, run softer bushings in front then in the back.

Slides

I suck at them, but I can efficiently shut down my run when I have to. There are few ways to initiate and you cn combine them too. The carving tighter then the wheels can take is one way - you experienced it already. Other way is very sudden sharp turn with quick sinking to the board (cross-under), that unweighs the wheels and slide happens. Or, explosive up-unweighing (cross-over) with kicking of the rear foot into direction of the slide.

Enjoy!

[Gecko]

don't wedge/dewedge the drop carve you will only run into rail or foot bite issues....its also backwards from wedging/dewedging on a topmount

Wobbles are in your head and your weak ankles the more you skate the less problem you will have with wobs....when they happen drop your center (bend your knees) lean forward and turn. Wobs usually happen when the bushings are unloaded or lightly loaded turning puts a load on your trucks and makes them more stable

the Silverfish slide thread has a lot of good info, learn to slide with a hand down first, standups while very similar to snowboarding require a lot more skill

[Neil Gendzwill]

Wobbles are in your head and your weak ankles

Not entirely - sometimes you just hit the resonant frequency of the system and then you're screwed. It's why you need more stable geometry if you are consistently going really fast.

[BlueB]

I respectfully dissagree with most of what you've said...

don't wedge/dewedge the drop carve you will only run into rail or foot bite issues....its also backwards from wedging/dewedging on a topmount

Not really. It is quite common to dewedge the rear of a drop deck. Some people compensate for the loss of the turn in the back by adding some in front. Some not. Evo is a good example of wedge nose, dewedge tail and it probably won more downhill races then all the other decks combined.

Wobbles are in your head and your weak ankles the more you skate the less problem you will have with wobs....

This is a Silverfish kind of talk, where kids need to brag how good of the riders they are and put newbies down... Yes, you'll learn how to compensate or prevent wobs as you ride more, but system plays a big rolle too. You should know that as a slalom rider - tweeks can make huge changes to the performance, stabillity or turnines.

If system had nothing to do with it, take a flexy board, mount it with Bennetts and try to hit 50mph. You'll be lucky to get to 20, if that...

when they happen drop your center (bend your knees) lean forward and turn. Wobs usually happen when the bushings are unloaded or lightly loaded turning puts a load on your trucks and makes them more stable

I totally agree with the above.

[Gecko]

The Drop Carve is a drop through board, wedging and dewedging is indeed backwards compared to topmounted boards and doing so can lead to strange effects including hanger bite, railbite and footbite (I say this because I have both experienced it and seen it happen all to often). Any wedging on a dropthough will make the board lower not taller.

OK so the phrase "WOBs are in your head and your weak a$$ed ankles" is a bit obnoxious but there is more than a grain of truth to it. Most people panic when wobs set in (the head) they stand up, tense up (ankles) and lean back, the exact opposite of what you should do. Riding more and as a result strengthening your ankles is all that will in the end help you get over them. Yes you do need a stiff board but I DH a symmetrical shallow drop board (Clutch Lambchop) on Indy's with the rear truck dewedged about 3 degrees. The dewedging isn't for stability but rather to promote a smoother drift in corners, I can and have done 50mph on that board. No I don't race but that has more to do with my lack of trust in other riders in a pack than my setup. Going fast has more to do with the rider than it does the equipment the best example of that would be Scoot Smith last year he rode a Landy Evo this year he's on a Topmount S9 you can't get two boards more different than those and yet he's still just as fast. Reimer, the current world champ ride a shallow drop board with no wedging (though I believe he races on 46º plates)

For the record my first few runs of a day spent downhilling are always carving so I can loosen up my ankles, get a feel for the surface, my wheels, the available traction and occasionally whether I need to loosen up my bushings. I know I'm not good enough to just drop in and go fast first run.

[Puddy Tat]

Thanks everyone the responses are food for thought.

While i can't evaluate anyones other points yet, Gecko has a point about turning. I did notice the other day that while I was carving, there isn't any speed wobble, but when I come out of a carve into a straight-line, even though the speed doesn't seem to have picked up that much the board will go into a speed wobble. Loading the trucks definitely makes a difference.

I really enjoy the carving feeling I'm getting from this board. The deck has a bit of flex to it so it does seem to return some of the energy I put into it in the turn. I'll try and get some pics of me flailing around on it as the summer progresses.

[BlueB]

The Drop Carve is a drop through board, wedging and dewedging is indeed backwards compared to topmounted boards

Ah it's a drop-through, not drop... Yeah, the wedging/dewedging is kinda backwards, when you look where you add distance between baseplate and the deck. However, if you just look at the angle of pivoting axis to the deck, or kingpin to the deck, it's the same thing as on a topmount.

I totally agree that fast rider would be fast on anything, but I think that he'll still be fastest on tuned equipment. Analogue, a begginer would be faster/more comfortable on equipment that's not working against him. Same like placing bindings in right position, sharpening your edges, adjusting stnce and cants/lifts...

[Gecko]

It is generally though that its safer and easier to change the baseplate on a dropthough board rather than wedge/dewedge

I haven't figured out the bushing setup yet on this yet

My latest......Designed for Parking garage races and other Tech Downhill

Clutch Portagee 36"x10" 27.75" & 28.75"WB (yeah its short)

Hybrid Indy's

Venom Bushings

Traction bolts

Gator Grip (36grit)

78a Divine 70mm wheels

MHS Blueballs

Khiro Shock Risers

the rear is dewedged a hair because I know from experience it makes the rear track and drift better

[tenorman]

hi PUDDY TAT

try getting over the front truck more to offset/prevent wobbles in the first place. this is a common problem with drop through decks in that you can't really put your foot over the front truck like you can with a top mount.

that being said there is no law that says you have to drop through the trucks--you can simply top mount the trucks. don't worry about the cutout--the baseplate itself will be strong enough to compensate for a bit of missing wood. that way you can dewedge the back without hangar bite. GECKO is correct that the only way to wedge/dewedge a drop through is to get a higer angle (wedge) or lower angle (dewedge) baseplate--you can typically only add about 3 or 4 wedging/dewedging washers (depending on the thickness of the deck) before the hangar gets drawn up into the cutout and strikes the underside of the deck on sharp turns. personally i have owned and ridden most of the dropped and drop through decks and i prefer the top mounts. i would rather have the carving traction of the top mount than the straight line stability of the dropped design.

also ride the softest (not the hardest) bushings you can get away with for your weight. this flys in the face of conventional wisdom but the softer bushings allow you to tighten down the kingpin more. the problem with bushings that are too hard is you have to loosen the kingpin so much just to be able to turn that the kingpin starts rattling at high speeds which allow those weird oscillations to build up. obviously if the bushings are too soft then you will never be able to crank them down enough to be stable--you will likely tear or damage the bushings first from overtightening. i think a lot of wobbles are the result of too LOOSE kingpins than too SOFT bushings.

[tenorman]

hi GECKO

i was unable to post anything on silverfish. i can log onto my account but can't access any forums. seems to hangup with the message "waiting for pixel quantserv..." flashing on the lower left corner of the firefox screen. could you crosspost this bol post onto silverfish for me?

i ended up taking a lot of photos at the vernon dh this year because i wrecked my EUROCARVE DAMAGED left shoulder that was already further aggravated when i had to lay down my motorcycle 2 days earlier on thursday night.

the conditions at vernon this year were great. warm and sunny with a slight tailwind which made for faster than normal conditions. on my 4th practice run i think i got overconfident--my first 3 runs went so smoothly that i figured i wasn't pushing hard enough so on my 4th run i held my tuck longer before airbraking before the hard left dubbed CRASH CORNER and got worked. the lady who owns the bed and breakfast i stayed at is also a nurse and she later confirmed what i already suspected that i shouldn't suit up on sunday. i ended up watching on the sidelines and taking over 400 photos!!

here's the link to the photos of the 2011 vernon dh that took place june 11&12: http://s256.photobucket.com/albums/hh182/tenorman_bucket/vernondh2011/

i already told a lot of the racers that i would post the photos on silverfish so if you could do so at your earliest convenience i would really appreciate it.

also could you email EBASIL to ask if i have somehow been banned by mistake? in addition to being unable to post i can't use their contact screen either. my username on silverfish is the same as here--tenorman.

thanks

[Gecko]

I posted to Mal he left the following

I don't see any issues with this users account, I would suggest trying another browser and clearing the cache.

[tenorman]

I posted to Mal he left the following

I don't see any issues with this users account, I would suggest trying another browser and clearing the cache.

hi GECKO

i am posting this from the library. i was able to post to the fish from the library. since my ip address isn't blocked per kingston then it must be my browser settings or maybe my new computer (bought it beginning of march.)

thanks for looking into this matter for me.

hi PUDDY TAT

i have a board with a rear bear 852 mounted on a 20 degree grizzly baseplate with a jimz adapter fitted where the spherical was removed. unfortunately i am in the city right now and that board is stored a few hours away in the valley. i will try to get a photo of it up on bomberonline before friday. that could be the answer to all your wobble woes.

later

doug

[Gecko]

Try Chrome....that might solve your problems

I have 3 DH boards (all Sodafactory but they are local and I like the way Rus thinks about building boards). the Short WB topmount above for Techie DH, Garages and our local cemetery, my shallow drop for pure speed and a funky rocker'd dropthrough for freeride.

[tenorman]

hi PUDDY TAT

the first photo shows the exact same grizzly 852 hangar as yours mounted onto a 20 degree smokey baseplate. contrast this with the second photo showing the same hangar mounted to the stock 52 degree grizzly plate (ignore the 7 degree wedge which kicks the front truck to a super turny 59 degrees--not very stable but quick turning and a rush when skating down cypress bowl road lol.) the extra stability of the 20 degree plate should alleviate most rider induced wobbles (usually the shaking knees of a newb when dropping into a steep hill lol.) although i top mounted the trucks you can see that there is sufficient clearance even if you wanted to mount them drop through.

the third photo shows that i just top mounted the trucks onto a board with drop through cutouts for a randal style baseplate. don't worry about covering up the holes the baseplate will keep the cutout from shifting and twisting when riding hard.

after you get some mileage under your belt riding top mounted you can then mount the trucks drop through style to work on your standup slides for freeriding. you will notice a decrease in traction but an increase in stability (in non-turning situations) when the trucks are mounted drop through style.

since you are in edmonton you should go down to the local124 skateboard shop to learn and skate with the crew there. the 2 ringleaders are known as BIG mike and LITTLE mike. BIG mike is mike sanders the shop owner. LITTLE mike is mike G (i can't pronounce or spell his last name because there are at least 50 letters!!) these two guys are excellent skaters (both racing and freestyling.) i am sure these guys will get you sorted out in no time. tell them you know me from this forum and they will look out for you.

[BlueB]

That's super sweet setup, Doug! And elusive old school Kryptos, too!

I'll go cut my "Virus" drop-through style now.

[Steve Prokopiw]

right on one the world's best paved paths with 3% at each end of the 72 mile,10 foot wide,Trail of the Coeur d'Alenes;

I can feel another hobby coming on:)