ohiomoto

I don't feel like I have any trouble with the transitions. The upper body is quiet and my lower body is quick to make a new edge. I feel really good everywhere except at the end of the healside turn where I can feel the edge break. I just keep adding rotation as I go through the healside to keep the hips squared up. It feels really good but then I feel the nose start to load up and sometimes I lose the tail slightly. Seems like I should be able to work it out pretty quckly with the ideas you guys have given me. Quick question on the cants. Would putting my 3 degree disk under my front foot and the 0 under the back make more sense? I'm thinking that would give me more leverage towards the healside. The back knee would move out and back towards the toeside edge and the toeside knee would move back and cant in towards the toside edge. This should move me back and give me more leverage on the healside. I would lose the heal lift, but my stance is narrow anyway. Worth a try or bad idea?

Thanks guys! I'm overdoing the rotation. I have been taking it all the way through the bottom of the turn. I'll try some of the things mentioned here.

Thanks. That is exactly what I feel. The nose loads up, pressure builds up under the front foot and the tail gets light. So besides fighting it off with the thighmaster muscle what else can I do. Back off the rotation? Bump up the angles? I realize riding is the only way to sort it out. I'm just looking for ideas to take along with me.

I'm not the OP, but thanks for pointing that out. I wouldn't have know this otherwise and I would just assume that I would get the same kind of customer service I'm used to from the big companies that mail order bicycle parts. So I need to look at you guys like a I would an independent frame builder. Those guys are usually a one man operation. CS is really all about customer expectations. If you meet them, they are happy. Sometime we simply have the wrong expectations.

Okay, I'm getting the feeding thing over and over. I'll put a lot of focus there.What about the rotation? When, where, and how much? Is it possible to over-rotate on the healside? Progressive or static rotation (keep rotating throughout the turn or just enough to start it and then "hold the position")? The hands definitely helped out. I use to use the "tray" to keep the hands and shoulders level, but reaching for the boot keeps you level AND OVER THE EDGE! Awesome little tip and yes, I used it for both healside and toeside. I dig it! I was really looking at those toeside pictures too. I know better than to reach for the snow and while sticking my ass in the air. That will get you nowhere fast. But I was looking at the open knees, specifically the back knee and how they were not tucked in. I gave it a try and I couldn't believe how much the back knee hooked up the toe side!! I sort of took the knee back and down into the turn/towards the snow. WOW! The light bulb went off immediately. "If I can adjust my set up so that my back knee out, starts further out it could work like that for my healside too!" Everything that I was reading from you about angles and canting made perfect sense. TD1s so no canting there. I can bump the cuff on my boot out 2 degrees though. Should have the same effect. Also, If I bump the angle out a couple of more degrees and leave the forward lean down on the back boot that will move my knee out a little and give me more leverage when I bring it over on the healside. Currently running 55/55 with 3* in the back. I have the original 3-1/2" disks so I'm pretty limited until I upgrade. Also, I should add I'm on a K2 Skinny 167 and I'm 6'3" 230. I realize that I will over power the board in less than ideal conditions. Also, about 19-1/2" stance width is all I can get out of it. I'll upgrade the board at some point, but there is room for improvement with my skill set so I may as well work on it now. Tim

Did I read that right? A YEAR?! I have never heard of anyone taking a product back for after a year. It never hurts to ask, but how could you be disappointed with the results?I can understand the OP being a little disappointed. I buy a lot of cycling parts and the stuff aways ships really fast. Usually the parts are on the way the next day, so I guess I've gotten use to that level of service. I'd be a little bummed if the parts didn't ship that fast unless I knew it up front, but I would bash a company over it. As far a the actual time for shipping and customs is out of their hands.

Thanks HotBeans. I think I'm close on that advice and it fits in perfectly with what I'm doing though I never use to feed the board. I think that is already helping. I'll pay more attention to my butt crack too. :) Thanks Tim W. I've got that part. I have a bit of a figure eight movement pattern. I'm goofy. I if the center of the clock is neutral, my knee goes to 1, then 2, 3 and then works back to 4, 5 and then center for a healside turn. It then goes to 11, 10, 9 and then works back to 8, 7 and then center for the toeside. If you follow the pattern it look like a "8". Not sure how good I am at that though, so I'm probably working more diagonally as you described. If you think about it, the "8" should feed the board out...maybe I should pay a little more attention to that and see if I can improve it. Then again, maybe the "8" sucks? lol Edit: Another though on the 2pm movement of the knee. One of my issues is that I seam to have too much pressure on the front foot as I exit on the healside. It seams like this might make things worse. I have no problems initiating a healside turn, just finnishing it. On the other hand maybe more focus in this area will help get more edge angle which might help? Worth trying I suppose.

From: http://www.bomberonline.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=24911 Great article! I have seen the reaching for the snow syndrome. Lucky for me, my ski background keeps me straight. :) The funny thing is my toeside is great but my healside is weaker. I'm still trying to find the right skill to execute it consistently. After reading and looking at the pictures in that article I realize that I'm not dropping the hips enough on my healside turns. I think I'm rotating my hips too much. Having my hips facing forward limits angulation and I stack up much like the good toeside turns you have pictured. The problem is that it's easier to create more edge angle on the toeside by using the knees and ankles. That won't work on the healside, so you have to drop the hips. Does that make sense? I'll give it a try tomorrow and see if it helps. As stated above, I like the stacked feeling I get from rotating towards the tip. I spent all day today working on it. I tried less rotation and break at the waist to allow my hips to drop, but felt less powerful. (I was not bent over at the waist. Just more upper/lower body separation and angulation. No "toilet seat" here :) ) Still not sure on this issue other that maybe I just need more practice and commitment?We had hero snow today so I felt really good, but still managed to break the tail a couple of times. Two things I did today that worked really well for me. 1) I tried reaching for my "outside" boot on my turns. I've always tried to keep my hands level, but this technique really did work! I imporved what I always thought was a strong point for me. Cool. 2) I used my back knee and ankle more than ever. Driving it back and forth across the board with each turn. I've always driven my rear knee behind the front. Today my moves were more latteral and I never really used it on my toeside before. Wow! This really did add power to my turns. I can see why some are moving towards lower binding settings.

From: http://www.bomberonline.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=24883 Thank you. This is very helpful. That's what I've been doing so I know that I'm at least headed in the right direction. Two more questions: 1) About rotation? Is it progressive and ongoing throughout the turn? What I mean is do you keep adding more or is there a point (maybe as you begin crossing the fall line as you exit the turn) at which you need to back off? I wonder if I might be over-rotating on my heal side turns. When I carve round turns on skis, I rotate my lower half/hips throughout the turn. I keep playing with it on the snowboard, but I'm not 100% sure what's going on yet. (I'm not trying to take this too far off topic. I just think I need to understand this before I can fine tune my set up. ) 2) I have the original TD1s with 3* in the back and 0* up front. My board will only allow me a 19" stance which is slightly narrower than my shoulders. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think I can run too much more heal lift because my stance isn't very wide to begin with. The TD1s don't allow me to cant the boot outward, though I could use the cuff to open my knees up. I was thinking about putting the 3* disk up front and flat on the back. My thought was that it put more weight to the back foot and open up my back knee allowing me to drive it into the turn more. Or maybe I should try running less forward lean on the back boot even though it sounds counter productive. Do either of these idea have any merit? 1) I like the power that I feel I'm getting from the rotation on my healside, but still not sure if I'm over doing it. Any input here would be great.2) I think my set is okay for now and I need to focus on my skills. But what do I know?

Hello, I am the new guy here. Great place. I've already picked up a few ideas that have worked well for me. Okay, I am trying to dial in my riding. I've been ridding hard boots just a few days each season since 1995. I never got too serious about it mainly because I was always more focused on my skiing. Like many of you here, I have a problem with carving: "Hello, my name is Tim and I am a Carvoholic. My last carve was this afternoon and it was incredible. I want to carve anything that I put on my feet. I just love to carve!" Anyway, I actually ride pretty well. At least that's what I'm told, but I've never even seen a picture of me on a board, so I can't say for sure. I will say that I do feel pretty strong and competent though not always completely confident. So here is how I ride: I'm tall, but I try to "ride compact". I try to ride over the edge and keep my hands off the snow. I stay square to the nose and I rotate my hips into the turn. I'm not trying to lay it out EC style (maybe later.) A. My toe side turns come pretty easy for me. I have no problem keeping a quiet upper body and creating the angles I need with my lower body. B. Most of my healside turns feel good with some being great and others not so great. I'm getting better and I think I'm headed in the right direction but I need more information. Below I posted a few questions I posed in some other threads along with any replies I received. If you feel qualified, I would appreciate it if you would read them and offer any advice that seams like it might be what I'm looking for. Even if it's just a confirmation that I'm going in the right direction, that would help. If you need more information, just ask. I'm pretty analytical about this stuff and should be able to answer any questions about what I'm doing on the board. Thanks in advance! Tim

I was overtaken twice this week. Both times they were on my healside and I never heard. The one lady was on skis (pretty strong skier, stayed pretty much in the fall line on every run) even apologized to me as I was sliding to a stop at the bottom of the hill. At least that is what my buddy told me. I didn't hear her. :)

Great article! I have seen the reaching for the snow syndrome. Lucky for me, my ski background keeps me straight. :)The funny thing is my toeside is great but my healside is weaker. I'm still trying to find the right skill to execute it consistently. After reading and looking at the pictures in that article I realize that I'm not dropping the hips enough on my healside turns. I think I'm rotating my hips too much. Having my hips facing forward limits angulation and I stack up much like the good toeside turns you have pictured. The problem is that it's easier to create more edge angle on the toeside by using the knees and ankles. That won't work on the healside, so you have to drop the hips. Does that make sense? I'll give it a try tomorrow and see if it helps.

Nicely done!

As a skier I'm against gross body movements and full body leans sound gross! :) The truth is that the CM must move to the inside of the turn and large movements are going to happen. The question is do you want to get there with some precision or just flop the CM over there? Either way, I suspect that you are splitting hairs here. Sure, 15 degrees probably makes a difference in your ability to use your ankles, but it's not like you they work at 45 degree and not at all at 60 degrees. It's more a blend of skills and a the set up might allow you to blend them differently. Is there really a right or wrong answer here?

Thank you. This is very helpful. That's what I've been doing so I know that I'm at least headed in the right direction. Two more questions: 1) About rotation? Is it progressive and ongoing throughout the turn? What I mean is do you keep adding more or is there a point (maybe as you begin crossing the fall line as you exit the turn) at which you need to back off? I wonder if I might be over-rotating on my heal side turns. When I carve round turns on skis, I rotate my lower half/hips throughout the turn. I keep playing with it on the snowboard, but I'm not 100% sure what's going on yet. (I'm not trying to take this too far off topic. I just think I need to understand this before I can fine tune my set up. ) 2) I have the original TD1s with 3* in the back and 0* up front. My board will only allow me a 19" stance which is slightly narrower than my shoulders. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think I can run too much more heal lift because my stance isn't very wide to begin with. The TD1s don't allow me to cant the boot outward, though I could use the cuff to open my knees up. I was thinking about putting the 3* disk up front and flat on the back. My thought was that it put more weight to the back foot and open up my back knee allowing me to drive it into the turn more. Or maybe I should try running less forward lean on the back boot even though it sounds counter productive. Do either of these idea have any merit?

Oh, I get your point now and I agree. Yeah, about 90% snowboarders I see suck too. lol That said, I think shaped skis do help most skiers to some degree. They want to turn...even in wedge turns. They work even if you're not carving.

I bought my board back in 95 and never rode a soft boot until last season. I have fun carving on that board too. Anyway, also never rode a true hard boot until about a week ago. I use to run 60/60 with my 29.5 ski boots and still had overhang. Now I run 55/55. I feel much better riding in the new boots. My biggest issue at this point is that I feel like I'm still searching for the key to consistent healside turns. It feels like if I rotate into the turn too much all the pressure goes to the front foot and the back of the board slides slightly. I get some really nice turns too, but I can't figure out the key to keeping the carve clean. I've wondered if I'm getting enough edge angle and if in need more leverage. But then thought if I got more leverage from the front boot, it would load up even more. ??? (Not trying to hijack the thread. This just feels like the right place to ask.)

Respect to anyone who carves the snot out of anything. Most of the kids out there could carve a turn to save their life. Every once in a while I see one or two and I usually go out of my way to let them know I think it's cool. Often times I'm on skis and there looking at me like "What? Cool, thanks."

One of the problems with the equipment back before the SCX is that you had to have some speed before the skis would work with their limited sidecuts. The other problem was that many of them couldn't handle the speed. If you want to carve like you are on alpine gear get a set of true race stock Elan SLX skis. They have a 12m radius and hold both edges (yes, you have to use both skis) like there is no tomorrow. They are really stout, yet they don't feel stiff. Pretty amazing skis for carving. The boots have changed dramatically also. If you were to compare a race stock boot from say 2000, to a 3-4 year old race stock boot of equal flex, you would be amazed at how much softer the forward flex is. They allow you to stay centered on the ski even when your ankles are flexed. The days of working the front of a ski are gone. The shape does all of the work. Okay, sorry...I got all worked up there. I get excited about carving anything on snow. I'll chill out now. But before I do, I will drop one last piece of info for anyone who is interested in high level carving on skis. YOU HAVE TO USE THE INSIDE SKI! To do it well, the inside ski must engage first and then pull the outside ski through the turn. You want to reduce counter and tip lead as much as possible. I liken it to a fulcrum where the the outside of your body rotates through the trun around the axis of your inside hip. The focus is on the inside hip and you use the inside ankle and knee to create the angles for what ever trun you want to carve (don't bank.) If you know how to put pressure and ride the outside edge of the inside ski at turn initiation, you will be able to carve turns much like you do on an alpine board. It's really, really cool too. :) I bet I could teach an alpine carver how to lay out some really dynamic double carves pretty quickly. I think the movement paterns are very similar.

I didn't even take the time to read the replies yet but...F--- YEAH IT MAKES A DIFFERENCE!!! How about I put you on an alpine board with no side cut? Does that sound fun to you? lol Modern skis (and boots) make a huge difference. I actually think some of the credit should go to snowboards. I remember watching people carving up the hill on snowboards. I was jealous! BTW I was a level 2 certified instructor and would of, could of, should of easily been level 3 but I stopped instructing when we had our first child. I'm primarily a skier also. Most my days are spent leaving two trenches in the snow behind me, so I feel qualified to answer the question.

What I was asking is if they were 3-1/2" or 4" in diameter, not the pattern. My stuff is 3-1/2" (original TD1s).

I will say this. I about threw my RTRs in the trash after one run! Those liners are hard when you first put them on. I thought someone clamped my feet in a box of 2x4s. The good news is after a few days they fit and feel great! Good luck with sale.

Okay, don't take that last post the wrong way. No, I do not think I am gods gift to skiing and I apologize for writing the word "skiing" so often. Please don't take me the wrong way. :)

Ha, ha! Jesus built my hot rod too.I've tried skiing with headphones many times. I seem to have a hell of a time keeping them in my ears under my Giro Talon helmet. I pretty much gave up on it, but I always kept the volume pretty low. On skis, I felt pretty comfortable with them because: 1. The volume was low enough that I could hear my skis (and carry on a normal conversation on the lift). 2. I ski a really small hill and it is very easy to keep track of my surroundings. 3. Most of my riding is done weekday mornings, so crowds are low. 4. I ski faster than 99% of the people on my hill so most of my attention is mostly on what's in front of me. 5. I'm pretty versatile on skis and can react quickly if needed. I wouldn't use them on a snowboard because: 1. I suck! If someone gets in my way, all I can do is hit them. Just ask my wife. I plowed her over one time. lol (Okay, I'm not THAT bad, but I really did plow my wife over once.) Another funny thing I have noticed in my area. Most of the kids ride boards but none of them can carve a turn to save their life. So they pretty much bomb the hill like goons on a skateboard while the skiers are swooping across the hill on their shaped skis. It's like a complete 180 form the way it was 15 years ago except the skiers are the ones still complaining about "those damn snowboarders!" :)

3-1/2" or 4" discs?