General help with boots.

[Micamack]

Mica, I see you're local to DC: I highly recommend going to see Brian Eardley at the Ski Center (202) 966-4474 http://www.skicenter.com/ Brian is a really good boot fitter (almost as good as Erik). Make sure you call ahead and make an appointment with Brian - and when you get there, don't let them slough you off on someone else...

thankyou tons for the recommendation. I figure whatever Ski Chalet is doing to my boots at the moment i will let them finish and try them out this weekend. but if they do not improve. Definitely going to give this a try. Do i mention how you referred me or does not really matter?

[Mark Brown]

thankyou tons for the recommendation. I figure whatever Ski Chalet is doing to my boots at the moment i will let them finish and try them out this weekend. but if they do not improve. Definitely going to give this a try. Do i mention how you referred me or does not really matter?

Never been impressed with the Ski Chalet folks - good prices at the summer warehouse sale, but that's about it.

Brian probably won't remember me, but he might remember my boots - just tell him a hardbooter sent you ;)

[Micamack]

Never been impressed with the Ski Chalet folks - good prices at the summer warehouse sale, but that's about it.

Brian probably won't remember me, but he might remember my boots - just tell him a hardbooter sent you ;)

yeah they never really impressed me but its the best place ive found so far. ive gone through a few places all much ****tier than ski chalet.. still havent found "that place" yet.

okay ill let him know hahaha

p.s. did u have similar problems as me before going to brian?

[wvrocks]

Never been impressed with the Ski Chalet folks - good prices at the summer warehouse sale, but that's about it.

Brian probably won't remember me, but he might remember my boots - just tell him a hardbooter sent you ;)

I'll second Brian's work. He did a great job on my Deeluxe 700s. He's seen at least 2 hardbooters now!

Doesn't really matter what your foot issues are, he should be able to help. Be aware that it might require a smaller boot.

There's only so much you can do if the shell is way too big.

He opened his new shop on Catoctin Circle in Leesburg on Monday 11/16. The name of the shop is Pro Fit Ski & Boot and

will focus on ski and boot work.

Alpine Ski Shop has been pretty good to work with too. Brian does sales there but not fitting.

[Mark Brown]

I'll second Brian's work. He did a great job on my Deeluxe 700s. He's seen at least 2 hardbooters now!

Doesn't really matter what your foot issues are, he should be able to help. Be aware that it might require a smaller boot.

There's only so much you can do if the shell is way too big.

He opened his new shop on Catoctin Circle in Leesburg on Monday 11/16. The name of the shop is Pro Fit Ski & Boot and

will focus on ski and boot work.

Alpine Ski Shop has been pretty good to work with too. Brian does sales there but not fitting.

Two different guys: Brian Eardley at the Ski Center in DC - did a great job of molding my liners on two different sets of boots along with some tweaks to solve some toe bruising; and Brian Deely of Pro-Fit Ski & Boot (used to be Pro-Fit Ski & Skate) in Leesburg, VA - I've heard good reports of Brian Deely's work, but have no direct experience with him...

[Mark Brown]

p.s. did u have similar problems as me before going to brian?

No, not specifically. He molded my liners, punched out the toes to solve a toe bruise issue, and tweaked the shells - can't remember exactly what he did (the mind is a terrible thing to waste, if you ever had one...)

[Micamack]

I'll second Brian's work. He did a great job on my Deeluxe 700s. He's seen at least 2 hardbooters now!

Doesn't really matter what your foot issues are, he should be able to help. Be aware that it might require a smaller boot.

There's only so much you can do if the shell is way too big.

He opened his new shop on Catoctin Circle in Leesburg on Monday 11/16. The name of the shop is Pro Fit Ski & Boot and

will focus on ski and boot work.

Alpine Ski Shop has been pretty good to work with too. Brian does sales there but not fitting.

very helpful, thankyou

[Micamack]

No, not specifically. He molded my liners, punched out the toes to solve a toe bruise issue, and tweaked the shells - can't remember exactly what he did (the mind is a terrible thing to waste, if you ever had one...)

hahahaha

aight. so we got 2 different brians and both are good.

[wvrocks]

Two different guys: Brian Eardley at the Ski Center in DC - did a great job of molding my liners on two different sets of boots along with some tweaks to solve some toe bruising; and Brian Deely of Pro-Fit Ski & Boot (used to be Pro-Fit Ski & Skate) in Leesburg, VA - I've heard good reports of Brian Deely's work, but have no direct experience with him...

Crap, you are correct. Deely did my boots.

[John Gilmour]

I weigh about 165-172.

I had doubts as to whether the supercharger would support me ( I was thinking of using it as a light weight hardshell carvingboot. Also the plastic is thin...However I was super attracted to its light weight..

Also in extreme flexion. the superchargers boots buckles "stack" and stop the boot abruptly from flexing.

F=MA

force equals Mass times acceleration (also deceleration) You are a big fellah which means lots of mass which means lots of force coming to bear on your feet if the boot abruptly halts forward flex without slowly deforming or absorbing it.

Shin bang can sideline me for days...or even a week..and the pain builds as the season progresses.and if the deceleration of stopping flex is sudden... ouch..

I had shin bang from my Head Stratos boots because I also would "buckle stack" and perhaps catch a jack hammer on east coast ice. I now am in Raichle 700T boots with Strolz custom injected liners..

The 700T boots feel a little more "vague" like there is some latency between when I tell the boot to do something and when the energy goes to the board..but I am adjusting to that (pre turning) . The Strolz liners in combo with the 700T and a Bomber BTS have pretty much reduced shin bang to near ZERO. I still catch "Jackhammers" from time to time...but with less overall pain...perhaps the knees feel it a bit more because I can catch more of them a day than before..

But feeling the comfort, confidence and power I feel now..I would not go for the supercharger boot... also the liner in the supercharger is very thin and does not compress and absorb much. (the colors of the neon green yellow ones are cool though as are the stylish buckles).

If you have to use the supercharger...well... Srolz liners would help..but are pricey.. I had to go up a 1/2 shell size and throw away my old boots to accommodate the larger Strolz liner...

Since your shells are already a bit big... they don't look too small for a a strolz...but ...... alas they might be a 1/2 size too big.. but don't rely on me...

I'm no boot fitter.... just a customer..giving my experience..

Any good boot fitter can help you...and likely the better ones are not in high volume sales shops at all... but in smaller shops. Big shops just try to make the sale and get you out the door to get to the next customer. Also boot fitters close to mountains seem to get more direct feedback..also customers keep going there until they get it right.

I also was fitted with footbeds at the same time my Strolz liners were foamed..

for the pain saved and performance gains... it was without doubt the best $625 I ever spent in gear- and the Strolz liners durability are said to outlast the shells.

Note I still had to have sections of the boots blown out afterwards.. but now...I could sleep in them... and I find the liners much more supportive than any heat molded liner I have tried.

Beckmann.... did you help Pete Jacobs cut up his boots? I think they were Langes.. pete's boots allowed him to ride as if he was boneless after that mod.. I think Tim Flight helped him on that.

[Micamack]

I weigh about 165-172.

I had doubts as to whether the supercharger would support me ( I was thinking of using it as a light weight hardshell carvingboot. Also the plastic is thin...However I was super attracted to its light weight..

Also in extreme flexion. the superchargers boots buckles "stack" and stop the boot abruptly from flexing.

F=MA

force equals Mass times acceleration (also deceleration) You are a big fellah which means lots of mass which means lots of force coming to bear on your feet if the boot abruptly halts forward flex without slowly deforming or absorbing it.

Shin bang can sideline me for days...or even a week..and the pain builds as the season progresses.and if the deceleration of stopping flex is sudden... ouch..

I had shin bang from my Head Stratos boots because I also would "buckle stack" and perhaps catch a jack hammer on east coast ice. I now am in Raichle 700T boots with Strolz custom injected liners..

The 700T boots feel a little more "vague" like there is some latency between when I tell the boot to do something and when the energy goes to the board..but I am adjusting to that (pre turning) . The Strolz liners in combo with the 700T and a Bomber BTS have pretty much reduced shin bang to near ZERO. I still catch "Jackhammers" from time to time...but with less overall pain...perhaps the knees feel it a bit more because I can catch more of them a day than before..

But feeling the comfort, confidence and power I feel now..I would not go for the supercharger boot... also the liner in the supercharger is very thin and does not compress and absorb much. (the colors of the neon green yellow ones are cool though as are the stylish buckles).

If you have to use the supercharger...well... Srolz liners would help..but are pricey.. I had to go up a 1/2 shell size and throw away my old boots to accommodate the larger Strolz liner...

Since your shells are already a bit big... they don't look too small for a a strolz...but ...... alas they might be a 1/2 size too big.. but don't rely on me...

I'm no boot fitter.... just a customer..giving my experience..

Any good boot fitter can help you...and likely the better ones are not in high volume sales shops at all... but in smaller shops. Big shops just try to make the sale and get you out the door to get to the next customer. Also boot fitters close to mountains seem to get more direct feedback..also customers keep going there until they get it right.

I also was fitted with footbeds at the same time my Strolz liners were foamed..

for the pain saved and performance gains... it was without doubt the best $625 I ever spent in gear- and the Strolz liners durability are said to outlast the shells.

Note I still had to have sections of the boots blown out afterwards.. but now...I could sleep in them... and I find the liners much more supportive than any heat molded liner I have tried.

Beckmann.... did you help Pete Jacobs cut up his boots? I think they were Langes.. pete's boots allowed him to ride as if he was boneless after that mod.. I think Tim Flight helped him on that.

Very very informative, thank you. appreciate it.

At this point in time. I am basically keeping this forum as a reference and trying out a bunch of stuff.

One question, never heard about stack buckling. whats that? it was something not really advertised at the time of the purchase of the boot. And to be honest I didn't do my research on the boot before I bought it. I normally do my research on everything. That's whats making this whole situation feel miserable for me. 450$ on a pair of boots that are garbage after one year. And the one year I did use them they hurt me 80% of the time.

[Beckmann AG]

Beckmann.... did you help Pete Jacobs cut up his boots? I think they were Langes.. pete's boots allowed him to ride as if he was boneless after that mod.. I think Tim Flight helped him on that

Yellow Lange Tii; I think Pete did that himself. I don't think Tim was involved, but I could be mistaken.

Once in motion, he did bear some resemblance to a squid, but it worked for him. Last I heard he had wrecked himself doing some sort of big air expo tour thingy. That was quite a few years ago.

never heard about stack buckling. whats that

When a four(or five)-buckle boot is overflexed, the middle buckles jam together. This creates an abrupt end point to the forward flex, and residual forward momentum is translated rudely to the shin.

[Micamack]

Yellow Lange Tii; I think Pete did that himself. I don't think Tim was involved, but I could be mistaken.

Once in motion, he did bear some resemblance to a squid, but it worked for him. Last I heard he had wrecked himself doing some sort of big air expo tour thingy. That was quite a few years ago.

When a four(or five)-buckle boot is overflexed, the middle buckles jam together. This creates an abrupt end point to the forward flex, and residual forward momentum is translated rudely to the shin.

simply put... when boot straps don't fit properly.. they don't give the required resistance to prevent things like shin bang?? my 2 bottom buckles fit just fine, 2 upper its a struggle to get them buckled.

[Beckmann AG]

RE: buckle stack.

I think John was suggesting just one of the many possible causes of shin bang. But then I can't speak for him.

In a correctly sized, (and perhaps modified) boot, it should be relatively easy to close all of the buckles.

Buckles are primarily for closure, not for affecting flex.

There is a very good chance that if you were in the 'correct' lower shell, you would not be able to connect, let alone close, the upper buckles, due to the volume of your lower leg.

So the problem is, finding a lower shell that fits your foot and ankle, and then finding someone with the wherewithal and interest to modify the cuff for you.

If it makes you feel any better, $450 is a cheap education. Don't beat your self up about it.

[Micamack]

RE: buckle stack.

I think John was suggesting just one of the many possible causes of shin bang. But then I can't speak for him.

In a correctly sized, (and perhaps modified) boot, it should be relatively easy to close all of the buckles.

Buckles are primarily for closure, not for affecting flex.

There is a very good chance that if you were in the 'correct' lower shell, you would not be able to connect, let alone close, the upper buckles, due to the volume of your lower leg.

So the problem is, finding a lower shell that fits your foot and ankle, and then finding someone with the wherewithal and interest to modify the cuff for you.

If it makes you feel any better, $450 is a cheap education. Don't beat your self up about it.

too bad the 450$ isn't granting me a college education :-(. That's a little bit more pricey of an education haha. So in ur opinion I find a lower shell that properly fits and then get my cuff customized on my next pair of boots..??

[John Gilmour]

Beckman has the same definition of "buckle stack". It was one of the reasons I ruled out the supercharger..I had considered trying to move the buckles.

Some boots are designed not to get buckle stack...like the original Raichle Flexon comp.

I know in inline skating boots as well as with ski boots and snowboard boots... if you look inside you will see some numbers typically printed on the cuff and the boot.

Don't be alarmed it they don't correspond to your mondo point size. The cuffs run in a range. So it might say on a pair of size 27.5 mondo point boots on the cuff "26.0- 28.5" which means that the cuff can fit those sizes.

You might be able to buy a larger cuff from Nordica. But again.. its the thin plastic on those superchargers..

I think they would be a killer boot if you are a freestyler and you want to throw down a triple corkscrew in a halfpipe competition...... but I would not want them to be my sole pair of boots to ride everyday... I would absolutely end up with the worst shin bang of my life on them with the stock liner.

Hopefully you can try another set of boots. I think the supercharger would be a decent dual purpose boot for someone weighing up to 140lbs. like for a 14- 16 year old teen... I thought it was a teen boot .... I think the size run was not that extensive (nothing bigger than 12) when I looked at them in the 2007-2008 season.

You still might ride them on occasion for light use.. like trying to learn to ride fakie/switch..or in powder.... (I think as a hard boot they would be a decent choice in powder) ...but not as your main boot.

[John Gilmour]

Yellow Lange Tii; I think Pete did that himself. I don't think Tim was involved, but I could be mistaken.

Once in motion, he did bear some resemblance to a squid, but it worked for him. Last I heard he had wrecked himself doing some sort of big air expo tour thingy. That was quite a few years ago.

When a four(or five)-buckle boot is overflexed, the middle buckles jam together. This creates an abrupt end point to the forward flex, and residual forward momentum is translated rudely to the shin.

Yeah Pete did get injured.... he left team Madd and went on the Budweiser Aerial Assault tour with Liam Barrett also from Madd (now Oakley's event marketing director) . We asked Pete for his Madd 170 back (we were short on boards and he was riding freestyle) ..and he said he gave it back..

So later I heard he was with students at Waterville Valley and he under-rotated doing a backflip on plates in the lift line. Snapped his neck in the worst possible way. Pete was quadriplegic. His neck vertebra actually overlapped.... and he was told he would have a better chance of winning mega bucks than ever walking again.

I asked Pete what deck he did it on..and he said it was a Rossignol. I said "too bad it wasn't on a Madd....you might have made the flip since it is so much lighter" .. (Actually it was an extra Madd 170) I guess Pete secretly hoped he would be able to ride the Madd 170 again and had stashed it. Pete had such crazy muscle control... he used to ride my 55+ mph motorized 2 weel drive shaft driven skateboard and do full on drifts at 25 mph in a driveway... insane...I don't think any other skater could do this with that kind of a match between balance and throttle control....and on inconsistentl pavement no less....

So while visiting paralyzed Pete in the hospital..I said "Pete" you are nearly super human with muscle control... if you could just command 5% of your former self you would be better off than most people..I said..you must be hardwired better..so don't give up..and just keep trying...particularly use your toes since those are so needed for balance....and you have such incredible balance you must have good connections with your feet- get the toes moving and maybe you could get it all back... but keep trying because there might be a window when things start to rewire and you don't want to miss that window and atrophy."

Kids kept shuffling into the room in tears looking at Pete their teacher/idol paralyzed..

But Pete kept at it... eventually after about 3 or so weeks he wiggled his toes (huge relief for everyone...Doctors were blown away)..and eventually went through and endless rehab of several years.

He now does backflips and front flips on Jet Skiis (we rode them together in pouring rain on lake Winnapasakee)... and last I spoke to him he was going into business administration. He won't skateboard for feel of not being able to run it out.. I think he snowboards a bit.

As for his boots prior to his accident he ended up mixing a yellow lange and a white lange.

Pete's "Squid riding" was because I first met him at Gunstock..His name tag on his instructor jacket was "Speedy". So we rode that night- blasting super high speed carves around piles of sitting jibber kids covering them in snow flumes.........I pretty much wasted Pete...as I had a more advanced lower riding technique (I also rode a bit too low as I was developing the hips forward gunfighter stance and was exaggerating the lowness) and better gear... (1992 F2 159 speedster for me... I think Pete was on a PJ or a Burton Stat (yuck)

Pete practiced constantly....and well Pete took the low riding thing to the limit... perhaps a bit too far... but he was cool too watch ride. The next year I was struggling to catch him... he took everything he saw from me and just went to another level.. Will Garrow rides a bit like him... just not as flexy as Pete....and if you ever saw Will ride you could only imagine.

BTW..Pete.. if you are ever reading this..I gave you 2 of my motoboards.... so you could make one working one out of them..and ...well you did......... if you aren't using it anymore (IE... you shouldn't be) ... send it over to me in Aspen.

[Ear dragger]

mica mack, you've got shells. you don't need dallbello shells. you need Liners! dall bello liners are the poop. put them in any boot. 450 for boots+250-300 for the liners = lots of dough for the feet! I'm standing on 800 bucks!

[Micamack]

Beckman has the same definition of "buckle stack". It was one of the reasons I ruled out the supercharger..I had considered trying to move the buckles.

Some boots are designed not to get buckle stack...like the original Raichle Flexon comp.

I know in inline skating boots as well as with ski boots and snowboard boots... if you look inside you will see some numbers typically printed on the cuff and the boot.

Don't be alarmed it they don't correspond to your mondo point size. The cuffs run in a range. So it might say on a pair of size 27.5 mondo point boots on the cuff "26.0- 28.5" which means that the cuff can fit those sizes.

You might be able to buy a larger cuff from Nordica. But again.. its the thin plastic on those superchargers..

I think they would be a killer boot if you are a freestyler and you want to throw down a triple corkscrew in a halfpipe competition...... but I would not want them to be my sole pair of boots to ride everyday... I would absolutely end up with the worst shin bang of my life on them with the stock liner.

Hopefully you can try another set of boots. I think the supercharger would be a decent dual purpose boot for someone weighing up to 140lbs. like for a 14- 16 year old teen... I thought it was a teen boot .... I think the size run was not that extensive (nothing bigger than 12) when I looked at them in the 2007-2008 season.

You still might ride them on occasion for light use.. like trying to learn to ride fakie/switch..or in powder.... (I think as a hard boot they would be a decent choice in powder) ...but not as your main boot.

yeah like i said..wished i had done my research

[Micamack]

mica mack, you've got shells. you don't need dallbello shells. you need Liners! dall bello liners are the poop. put them in any boot. 450 for boots+250-300 for the liners = lots of dough for the feet! I'm standing on 800 bucks!

any specific liner you recommend in general?

[Beckmann AG]

So in ur opinion I find a lower shell that properly fits and then get my cuff customized on my next pair of boots..??

Well, yes. If at all possible.

If you came to me for a footbed, with your present shells, we would not be doing business that day, as I would not waste your money.

Fitting boots on a computer is not always a good idea, but from the pictures you have posted, and the issues you have described, you do not have the right boots for your feet, lower legs, and body mass.

With all due respect to others with contrary opinions, a better liner in the wrong shell is a waste of your resources. You would be better off replacing your current liners with a few bags of marshmallows. You could then laugh, rather than cry, at the outcome.

I used a set of stock liners for at least 500-600 days (a conservative estimate), until they finally tore apart. This would not be possible if the boot shell was not a reasonable facsimile of my foot.

"Squid riding"

Meant in humor, not criticism...The boy was/is clearly talented. Good to know he's up and about.

[John Gilmour]

any specific liner you recommend in general?

I've used the Diabello and thermoflex- my personal best results were with the Strolz liners which are not heat molded- but injected. They mix two liquids together to form an expanding foam- which expands under incredible pressure filling every imaginable void..the leather (Yes they are leather) is top quality cow hide) . I found I could exert enough force to feel the plastic of the boot penetrate the liners of the heat moldables..this did no ever happen on the Strolz liners...even while riding a Kessler PGS at high speeds until I jackhammered..and felt...essentially ....ZERO PAIN. The foam is denser than most- yet absorbing..However I ride somewhat differently on that board..not as Chesty and forward as I would on a Madd. I would not suggest you have someone do the Strolz liners in a boot shell they have not foamed before. They can not be refoamed- and hence are really costly if you blow it.

However, the skill of the person doing the liners is paramount. If I needed a boot fitter on the East Coast I'd go see AG B. No matter what liner he was using- (even if he were to modify a stock liner) he would have a solution that likely would work better than most according to feedback I've heard from riders. Don't expect a miracle on the first fitting..expect to likely come back have 70-80% of any remaining issues fixed (they would be minor) and then perhaps once again for the remainder.....or not.

[Micamack]

Well, yes. If at all possible.

If you came to me for a footbed, with your present shells, we would not be doing business that day, as I would not waste your money.

Fitting boots on a computer is not always a good idea, but from the pictures you have posted, and the issues you have described, you do not have the right boots for your feet, lower legs, and body mass.

With all due respect to others with contrary opinions, a better liner in the wrong shell is a waste of your resources. You would be better off replacing your current liners with a few bags of marshmallows. You could then laugh, rather than cry, at the outcome.

I used a set of stock liners for at least 500-600 days (a conservative estimate), until they finally tore apart. This would not be possible if the boot shell was not a reasonable facsimile of my foot.

Meant in humor, not criticism...The boy was/is clearly talented. Good to know he's up and about.

this is the answer i've kinda wanted from the start...way back in my head. but what i was hoping for on all the other posts was quick fixes.. I am starting up a tech school and dont have much money.

so an update.... got my boots back from ski chalet in chantilly (ted worked on them). The shinbang instantly felt gone after he loosened the liner up and re-adjusted my straps..but that is more or less... something I just have to find out on the slopes. My ankle issue became more of a problem than I thought.. Before taking them in I could not put my boot on buckled or not buckled without it piercing through my ankle.. giving me an excruciating pain.

I THINK we fixed that buy raising my heel (we think my ankle was rubbing something on the shell where it was originally resting). So I got new foot inserts and custom inserts added to the bottom of the liner. I think that issue is gone as well. However we will see tomorrow/ sunday when im on my trip

[Beckmann AG]

I hope the present fix works out Ok.

Bear in mind that a heel lift affects boot performance as well as fit, so don't be surprised if you need to find a different balance point on your feet, for better or worse...

Take your first run on something fairly flat.

[tflight]

I think they were Langes.. pete's boots allowed him to ride as if he was boneless after that mod.. I think Tim Flight helped him on that.

I don't recall doing anything with Pete's boots, but if you want to credit me with helping his riding style-- I'll take it. ;)