newcarver Posted March 31, 2010 Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 http://www.democracynow.org/2010/3/31/we_are_tearing_down_our_mountains Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZetaTre Posted March 31, 2010 Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 http://www.democracynow.org/2010/3/31/we_are_tearing_down_our_mountains Interesting, but just because not a single word is spent talking about the impacts on jobs... But what you expect from these Berkeley Latte drinkers... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newcarver Posted March 31, 2010 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 Interesting, but just because not a single word is spent talking about the impacts on jobs... But what you expect from these Berkeley Latte drinkers... Why would anyone loose their jobs? Mining can be done without the major impact on landscape and local water supply. Just cost slightly more. They do it here in W. CO and it has minimal impact on the environment. It would just cut into their profit margin. To me, that seems like a small price to pay. This is a practice that was illegal until Bush deregulated the industry. Hope it goes back to the way it was before Bush mess it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZetaTre Posted March 31, 2010 Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 Why would anyone loose their jobs? Mining can be done without the major impact on landscape and local water supply. Just cost slightly more. They do it here in W. CO and it has minimal impact on the environment. It would just cut into their profit margin. To me, that seems like a small price to pay. This is a practice that was illegal until Bush deregulated the industry. Hope it goes back to the way it was before Bush mess it up. I find it hard to believe that it is completely job neutral, and if it was, I would have expected it to be mentioned in the report since it would have made the argument favoring a less intrusive way of mining coal stronger. The report, instead seems very biased and present only one side of the story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newcarver Posted March 31, 2010 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 According to Wikipedia, this form of mining has taken away jobs by making the process of extraction a lot less labor intensive. "Historically in the U.S. the prevalent method of coal acquisition was underground mining which is very labor-intensive. In MTR, through the use of explosives and large machinery, more than two and a half times as much coal can be extracted per worker per hour than in traditional underground mines,<SUP class=reference id=cite_ref-15>[16]</SUP> thus greatly reducing the need for workers. In Kentucky, for example, the number of workers has declined over 60% from 1979 to 2006 (from 47,190 to 17,959 workers)<SUP class=reference id=cite_ref-16>[17]</SUP>. The industry overall lost approximately 10,000 jobs from 1990 to 1997, as MTR and other more mechanized underground mining methods became more widely used.<SUP class=reference id=cite_ref-17>[18]"</SUP> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan Rover Posted March 31, 2010 Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 ZetaTre, what Newcarver says about mountain-top removal being less labor intensive than traditional coal mining is EXACTLY correct. And BTW, I didn't realize it was anybody's 'rightful' JOB to rip the heart out of mountains....what type of respect is THAT showing to the land? You seem utterly brainwashed by the diatribes of the ultra-right. But there IS a remedy for that....it is called thinking for yourself. Excuse me for being slightly brusk, but I just got back from the TGR forum and it takes me a little while to change back to a normal human being. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZetaTre Posted March 31, 2010 Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 I'm not following you there: why if someone thinks like you guys, than "thinks for himself" while if someone doesn't, then is "brainwashed"? Help me a bit with the logic here... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newcarver Posted March 31, 2010 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 Yep, It is all about profit at the peoples expense. They even get our tax $'s in the form of subsidies! So everyone in the US is helping fill up their wallets! Makes me sick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newcarver Posted March 31, 2010 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 On a side note about energy exploitation and job creation, Obama took away a ban on offshore oil drilling. This will help our curb our dependency on foriegn oil and create new jobs. I hope it will not result in any disasters though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan Rover Posted March 31, 2010 Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 I'm not following you there: why if someone thinks like you guys, than "thinks for himself" while if someone doesn't, then is "brainwashed"? Help me a bit with the logic here... It's always that way, Zeta. That's just the way it is with politics or religion or any other highly-charged topic. The conservatives use EXACTLY the same logic, as do the liberals. That's just part of the human syndrome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZetaTre Posted March 31, 2010 Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 It's always that way, Zeta. That's just the way it is with politics or religion or any other highly-charged topic. The conservatives use EXACTLY the same logic, as do the liberals. That's just part of the human syndrome. Well, I guess I gotta credit you for your honesty Now does that mean that we're both thinking for ourself or that we both got brainwashed... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan Rover Posted March 31, 2010 Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 Well, I guess I gotta credit you for your honesty Now does that mean that we're both thinking for ourself or that we both got brainwashed... Well....maybe we both got brainwashed into thinking that we're thinking for ourselves. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZetaTre Posted March 31, 2010 Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 Well....maybe we both got brainwashed into thinking that we're thinking for ourselves. ;) Oh man, c'mon... You ruined the debate!!!! :AR15firin eheheh!!! :ices_ange Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan Rover Posted March 31, 2010 Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 You reminded me, though, that I CAN use a latte....nah...just kidding, I stopped drinking those long ago when I decided they were a real rip in price. I now prefer plain, old coffee...but I DO manually-grind my own beans, though. Gotta have SOME indulgence! ;) ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZetaTre Posted March 31, 2010 Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 I now prefer plain, old coffee...but I DO manually-grind my own beans, though. Gotta have SOME indulgence! ;) ;) That's how my morning start before driving to the slopes: bean grinder and French press... I don't think I could do much without it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan Rover Posted April 1, 2010 Report Share Posted April 1, 2010 That's how my morning start before driving to the slopes: bean grinder and French press... I don't think I could do much without it... Yep...I am all about the French Press!...that's exactly the way I do it,too. I've had my share of burned gas-station coffee....so the fresh ground french press is like fresh air. Plus, we live at least half of every year on a sailboat, so the French Press is madatory...as there are no 110 volt outlets at sea. :) My sister grows her own coffee beans, so she roasts some and mails them up to us...mmmm mm good! Best small-time bean roaster we've come across is this company in Montana called "Montana Coffee Traders" in Whitefish, Montana. My favorite beans from them are: Buffalo Blend; Grizzly Blend; Glacier blend and my absolute favorite: Huckleberry...but they have a TON more. Their prices are good too, and they ship anywhere. http://www.coffeetraders.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petrol Posted April 1, 2010 Report Share Posted April 1, 2010 ZetaTre, what Newcarver says about mountain-top removal being less labor intensive than traditional coal mining is EXACTLY correct.... quite a bit Safer for those employed in the extraction process to boot. On a side note about energy exploitation and job creation, Obama took away a ban on offshore oil drilling. This will help our curb our dependency on foriegn oil and create new jobs.... in the words of Sam Alito, "Not True".and in the words of AR, "You seem utterly brainwashed by the diatribes of the.." p-bo conspiritors in the media. The "Ban" on offshore oil exploration was NOT lifted, what was done is a study has been launched (there's your job creation, wtg p-bo!) to determain the viability of leases & the impact of allowing limited oil exploration 50 miles off the mid Atlantic coast... All While at the same time BANNING oil exploration in ever more areas off the coast of Alaska, Cali & Florida Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvrocks Posted April 1, 2010 Report Share Posted April 1, 2010 ZetaTre, what Newcarver says about mountain-top removal being less labor intensive than traditional coal mining is EXACTLY correct. And BTW, I didn't realize it was anybody's 'rightful' JOB to rip the heart out of mountains....what type of respect is THAT showing to the land? You seem utterly brainwashed by the diatribes of the ultra-right. But there IS a remedy for that....it is called thinking for yourself. Excuse me for being slightly brusk, but I just got back from the TGR forum and it takes me a little while to change back to a normal human being. ;) My sister and brother in law are both consulting geologists in southern WV with 2 masters in geology and a masters in mining engineering between them. We were having a discussion about mountain top removal practices the other day that was quite interesting. Its more complicated than most can imagine. My sister has hiked both the AT and PCT, both are truely in love with the mountains. You can see the struggle in their heads when they talk about MTR. They have been in the homes of the people who live in these areas, they have talked to the poorest of the poor and the wealthiest mine owners. They see the dilemma of balancing environmental degradation, job loss, money moving outside the state, national energy costs up close and personal every day. According to them, the coal seams that are being mined by MTR are NOT mineable by "traditional" underground mining. The seams are too short and in a lot of cases not in suitable surrounding material to support deep mines. That being said the geographic area where MTR is a viable extraction method is fairly limited. I can't even pretend to understand all of the variables involved. The group of us talked for nearly two hours and it was one of the most interesting and frank discussions I've heard on the subject. In a world where MTR is a reality, my sister and BIL both want to see better reclamation practices, not only for coal but also in the oil and gas industry. ________ VAPIR NO2 VAPORIZER REVIEW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newcarver Posted April 1, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 1, 2010 The "Ban" on offshore oil exploration was NOT lifted, what was done is a study has been launched (there's your job creation, wtg p-bo!) to determain the viability of leases & the impact of allowing limited oil exploration 50 miles off the mid Atlantic coast... All While at the same time BANNING oil exploration in ever more areas off the coast of Alaska, Cali & Florida Obama Authorizes New Gas Drilling Off US Coasts President Obama has unveiled a new plan to open up large swaths of the Atlantic, Gulf and Alaskan coasts to offshore oil and gas drilling for the first time in decades. On Wednesday, Obama and Interior Secretary Ken Salazar said drilling permits would be issued along the East Coast from Delaware to the central coast of Florida. New areas of the southeast Gulf Coast will also be open to drilling, as will the Arctic Ocean north of Alaska. Speaking at Andrews Air Force Base, Obama said the plan would help lead the US toward energy independence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZetaTre Posted April 1, 2010 Report Share Posted April 1, 2010 Yep...I am all about the French Press!...that's exactly the way I do it,too.I've had my share of burned gas-station coffee....so the fresh ground french press is like fresh air. Plus, we live at least half of every year on a sailboat, so the French Press is madatory...as there are no 110 volt outlets at sea. :) My sister grows her own coffee beans, so she roasts some and mails them up to us...mmmm mm good! Best small-time bean roaster we've come across is this company in Montana called "Montana Coffee Traders" in Whitefish, Montana. My favorite beans from them are: Buffalo Blend; Grizzly Blend; Glacier blend and my absolute favorite: Huckleberry...but they have a TON more. Their prices are good too, and they ship anywhere. http://www.coffeetraders.com Have you tried adding a piece of dark chocolate in the coffee? It brings out the aroma very well. I think Lindt makes a chocolate bar with a very hight (IIRC above 95%) cocoa concentration. That's the perfect one!!! PS: wvrocks thanks for your comment, I was sure the story was a lot more complicated than presented in the video... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan Rover Posted April 1, 2010 Report Share Posted April 1, 2010 Have you tried adding a piece of dark chocolate in the coffee? It brings out the aroma very well. I think Lindt makes a chocolate bar with a very hight (IIRC above 95%) cocoa concentration. That's the perfect one!!! Yep!!! I do that ALL the time....for me, it sorta becomes a poor man's Mocha. Never tried Lindt in the coffee...but I often put a little dark baker's chocolate in the cup. Sometimes I just add a little bit of hot cocoa mix, but not enough to override the taste of the beans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZetaTre Posted April 1, 2010 Report Share Posted April 1, 2010 Yep!!! I do that ALL the time....for me, it sorta becomes a poor man's Mocha. Never tried Lindt in the coffee...but I often put a little dark baker's chocolate in the cup. Sometimes I just add a little bit of hot cocoa mix, but not enough to override the taste of the beans. It's best in an Italian style expresso coffee: just chocolate and coffe, no sugar... Yummie!!!!! Give a try to the Lindt if you find it... Have you ever had that caffee made with the beans pooped by that monkey? I can't recall how it's called (I guess I lost that with the brainwash) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newcarver Posted April 1, 2010 Author Report Share Posted April 1, 2010 Sounds like new EPA water quality regs will put a stop to the polution end of this type of mining. http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100401/ap_on_bi_ge/us_mountaintop_mining Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZetaTre Posted April 1, 2010 Report Share Posted April 1, 2010 Here it is: the pooped coffee I was telling you about: it's called Kopi Luwak (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kopi_Luwak) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskan Rover Posted April 2, 2010 Report Share Posted April 2, 2010 Here it is: the pooped coffee I was telling you about: it's called Kopi Luwak (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kopi_Luwak) Sounds delicious! I wonder how it would go with the plate of steamed brown beetles I had the misfortune of buying from a street vendor in Seoul, South Korea? They sell it like popcorn on the streets of Korea. What I DO wonder, is WHO in the world was the first person to think of roasting the beans from civet dung and making it into coffee????? ANYTHING is better than the cup of Dollar General Instant Coffee I just made!!! I'll NEVER buy that again....and continue to hand-grind, just sometimes don't have the time. I'll have to try the Lizdt...or whatever it was (MY brainwashing poses problems to me sometimes also.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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