kjl Posted August 25, 2005 Report Share Posted August 25, 2005 It's a rare injury, so I doubt anybody else has any direct experience, but just in the offchance somebody does... Anybody know how hard hardboot snowboarding is on your Posterior Cruciate Ligament (particularly on the rear leg)? I just got the PCL on my rear leg (right leg, riding regular) reconstructed a few weeks ago, and the 6 month mark, when you can supposedly go about doing whatever sports you like to do, is mid January. But I wonder just how hard it is on the PCL and if maybe I should stick to mostly softbooting this winter. More specifically, the PCL prevents your tibial head from moving backwards when your knee is bent (most people get the injury when their knees are bent in a car accident - the dashboard hits their tibial head and pushes it backwards), and in a hard toeside carve, when I bend my knees a lot, I feel pressure of the tongue of my boot on my shin - i.e. the tongue is pushing my tibia backwards. Any opinions? My doctor says it should be OK, but he might not fully understand the forces involved in hardboot carving. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skatha Posted August 26, 2005 Report Share Posted August 26, 2005 I've just had my ACL times two, but I'm also a doc with a special interest in knees....I had heard that, although routine use of braces were NOT recommended in ACL postop knees, braces were recommended in PCL postop's-reason-hyperextension on the knee could be catastrophic. Your knee should be maintained in just a hair's amount of flexion to take care of your new graft. I'd go to a sports medicine specialist, perhaps even to one that sees a bunch of skiiers/riders. I think Cindy Kleh mentioned somebody in a recent post about ankle injuries. No where is too far to fly for the best advice in my humble opinion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeW Posted August 26, 2005 Report Share Posted August 26, 2005 give a call to medical center in vail valley. very very strong sports medical center (had rehab there and surgery there after snapping my tibia bone hardbooting on rossi 184 in the backbowl of vail). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Randy S. Posted August 26, 2005 Report Share Posted August 26, 2005 I'm a big fan of the CTi2 brace from Innovation Sports. Check it out. Insurance should cover it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest thomas_m Posted August 26, 2005 Report Share Posted August 26, 2005 It's a rare injury, so I doubt anybody else has any direct experience, but just in the offchance somebody does... I completely ruptured my PCL playing soccer in college. Knee bent backward like a chicken leg... Had a major surgery to graft in a piece of tendon from my hamstring, 6 weeks in a toe-to-crotch cast and a ****load of rehab after. Since then, I've had to go in twice to get scar tissue and assorted gunk pulled out with a 'scope. Relaxing the hamstring and wiggling the tiba back and forth has been a party trick of mine for years... No problems at all hardbooting or softbooting but mine is my front knee not the rear. The knee injury was actually one of the big reasons I started snowboarding instead of skiing a few years back when I got the urge to slid down mountains. The only thing that really bothers me now is running and hiking down steep grades. I do have to spend a lot of time on my bike and working my quads becuase if they get weak, the knee gets floppy and it does start to cause problems. I'm not looking forward to dealing with that leg as I get old(er)... T. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kjl Posted August 26, 2005 Author Report Share Posted August 26, 2005 Thanks for the replies. Yeah, I see a knee/shoulder specialist who sees lots of skiiers. He's a skiier himself. I didn't know that about keeping it in flexion - they have been pretty aggressive in wanting me to get my full extension back as much as possible, and I'm already out of the brace for every day activities. But I do have a fitted brace already from last year that I (also from last year) set to not allow full extension (stops it at about 5 degrees). The question wasn't so much whether or not I should wear the brace (I will, definitely, for the first year of boarding and probably for next summer's sports, too), but whether I should be exposing my PCL to direct force on the front of the shin with hardboots at all, or if I should stick with softies for the first winter. I am imagining not only a powerful toeside carve, but in the worst case what would happen if I did one of those "lose the edge and then CHOP CHOP CHOP skid down on the toeside" which usually results in hard shocks up on the toes and thus backwards on the tibia. Also, I do the "face the nose" heelside turn, which would twist my right foot outwards slightly when my knees are bent, which I assume is really bad for the postero-lateral-corner I had rebuilt, too? Not that I have any idea what the postero lateral corner is... skatha - do you know approximately how strong PCL and posterolateral corner grafts are supposed to be after 6-7 months? 50% ? 80% ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kjl Posted August 26, 2005 Author Report Share Posted August 26, 2005 I completely ruptured my PCL playing soccer in college. Knee bent backward like a chicken leg... Ugh - nasty - mine was just a shock to the tibia (landed from a sprinting leap straight onto my bent knee on frozen mud playing ultimate frisbee). Relaxing the hamstring and wiggling the tiba back and forth has been a party trick of mine for years... Hah, yeah - me too. Well, not since the surgery, but before I had quite a bit of play in there and would waggle that bone back and forth. I'm sure it's a bad habit - I would do it a lot, like twiddling my thumbs while sitting at the computer waiting for stuff to happen. I'm probably doing it occasionally now just out of habit even as I try to protect the graft as much as possible... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr. sandman Posted August 26, 2005 Report Share Posted August 26, 2005 I've just had my ACL times two, but I'm also a doc with a special interest in knees....I had heard that, although routine use of braces were NOT recommended in ACL postop knees, braces were recommended in PCL postop's-reason-hyperextension on the knee could be catastrophic. Your knee should be maintained in just a hair's amount of flexion to take care of your new graft. I'd go to a sports medicine specialist, perhaps even to one that sees a bunch of skiiers/riders. I think Cindy Kleh mentioned somebody in a recent post about ankle injuries. No where is too far to fly for the best advice in my humble opinion I'm seeing a sports med podiatrist at SOAR in Redwood City/San Jose. They are a group and have specialists from the head down. While they don't specialize in snow sports, they are team docs for the Niners and some other pro teams - I would highly recommend this group. We've seen their spine specialist and other family members have seen their orthos - all with high regards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeW Posted August 27, 2005 Report Share Posted August 27, 2005 speaking of knee brace, i kinda ripped my left knee fairly recent from motorcycling. bought asterik, under different branch of innovation sports. highly recommend it since it's good for all sports. price? 500 to 600 bucks. i ain't bitchin' cuz its a whole lot cheaper than hospital bills. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdgang Posted August 27, 2005 Report Share Posted August 27, 2005 i got a donjoy defiance when I tore my acl a couple of years ago. runs about 900 but the insurance paid for it. I love it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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