Quads are driving me nuts

[Terryw]

Just want to give a nod to Beckmann AG here.  While I believe that no matter what you do, this sport is very demanding on your legs due to the athletic stance we need to maintain to carve in variable terrain. That being said, the best thing you can do for your comfort and longer carving days is to start out in a balanced and natural neutral stance. I carved for years before I learned how to tweak my set up to allow me to relax between carves and then drop in and hold that elusive heel side carve without chattering. Here is a link to an article Beckmann put together that goes through the process of finding a stance that will get you to that neutral starting point. The idea being that if you start out in this balanced position, you will not need to keep constant tension in your legs just standing on your board. This will wear you out much sooner as you won't have a chance to recover as easily between hard charging multiple carving slopes.  I will warn you it is lengthy, but it is very good information.

http://beckmannag.com/hardboot-snowboarding/hardboot-binding-configuration

 

 

[Beckmann AG]

Thanks Terry. Glad the material helped your riding.

[1xsculler]

Dumbbell squats were doing nothing for my burning quads so I switched to back against the wall, thighs horizontal for as long as I can hold it which produces a quad burn similar to what I feel when boarding. We’ll see!

[bigwavedave]

If you haven't already, get a therapist (massage, etc) to work on your legs. There's a reason top athletes not only train but get body work done.

Regarding leg presses and squats and such. Personally, I prefer leg extensions with ankle weights at home (or machines at the HC). It's less wear & tear on the cartilage in the knees and actually therapeutic. I save the weight bearing compressive squat abuse for actual riding.

[1xsculler]

2 hours ago, bigwavedave said:

If you haven't already, get a therapist (massage, etc) to work on your legs. There's a reason top athletes not only train but get body work done.

Regarding leg presses and squats and such. Personally, I prefer leg extensions with ankle weights at home (or machines at the HC). It's less wear & tear on the cartilage in the knees and actually therapeutic. I save the weight bearing compressive squat abuse for actual riding.

I appreciate the tip. If leg extensions produce the same quad burn as I get from carving I’ll do them. The back against a wall, thighs parallel to the floor certainly does produce the exact same burn I get from boarding whereas the dumbbell squats never did. It’s the isometrics that is common to both. 

[Corey]

That delivers a clue: If you are doing an isometric hold while snowboarding, it's hard to keep the edge engaged. Try to keep moving, up or down, through the turn. Nothing crazy, just continuous slight movement. 

It's easiest to start tall, drop towards the apex and extend through the finish. The opposite is push-pull where you start low and extend the legs out and then finish low again. 

Try playing with that next time you are out. This triggered a breakthrough for me in that I got more supple and ready to accept bumps/dips at any moment. 

[1xsculler]

18 minutes ago, Corey said:

That delivers a clue: If you are doing an isometric hold while snowboarding, it's hard to keep the edge engaged. Try to keep moving, up or down, through the turn. Nothing crazy, just continuous slight movement. 

It's easiest to start tall, drop towards the apex and extend through the finish. The opposite is push-pull where you start low and extend the legs out and then finish low again. 

Try playing with that next time you are out. This triggered a breakthrough for me in that I got more supple and ready to accept bumps/dips at any moment. 

Thanks, Corey!

[Chouinard]

23 minutes ago, Corey said:

The opposite is push-pull where you start low and extend the legs out and then finish low again.

My anecdotal input...the board responds very well to a push-pull rhythm especially on ice. Stay centered and rock the board edge to edge while pushing as hard as you can/want to depending on how tight of a turn you desire. It’s not the end all but just another technique to try.

[Tddragon]

So for what it's worth here is my experience as a very athletic hardboot beginner at 44. 

I play soccer all year 3-5x per week, tennis in summer 2-3x per week. And lift weights 2-4x per week. Started hardboot riding a few weeks ago. 

First day on hardboots I had to rest every few minutes. Just insane quad burn. Had to stop after a few runs with crazy calf muscle and tibialis anterior muscle (next to shin bone) pain. Was totally frustrated and didn't understand why my trained legs could not handle this. Second session I noticed that I was tightening my muscles to much, and also noticed a few other things like for example that my front quad - when I distributed weight just right and pushed with my rear shin into the boot in a relaxed way - got a wonderful relaxing break on my to side carve if I just stood a little taller. Played around with that all a bit but still had to rest at least 3-4 times on just a 2 Mile  run. Then suddenly on 3rd day it all clicked - I spent 6 hours without rest (Aside from chair lift) riding - didn't have to rest on slope even once - and although tired at end of day - and definitely feeling some burn - would have done a few more runs easily but lift closed - that day I did almost 27,000 vertical feet. Soooo.... I do think my year round training has been tremendously beneficial for snowboarding - I think it's still 90% technique/body position etc to avoid burn. My 2 "excited beginner" cents

 

Side note: for recovery I use a hypervolt percussion massage tool (have used that for years for soccer) / and that's been also very helpful whenever I get any very sore overworked spots (and helped with injury recovery as well in soccer)

Edited December 24, 2020 by Tddragon
Fixed typos and added some clarification :)

[MountainSlope]

On 12/24/2020 at 3:44 PM, Tddragon said:

So for what it's worth here is my experience as a very athletic hardboot beginner at 44. 

Soooo.... I do think my year round training has been tremendously beneficial for snowboarding - I think it's still 90% technique/body position etc to avoid burn. My 2 "excited beginner" cents

Hey there, great to hear you're starting out again this season. I read your message to hubby and he says the calf burning sounds like you may need to change your binding and boot settings. Post a bit about your settings (stance, angles, distance, flat or wedge)

[Tddragon]

1 hour ago, Puhutes said:

Hey there, great to hear you're starting out again this season. I read your message to hubby and he says the calf burning sounds like you may need to change your binding and boot settings. Post a bit about your settings (stance, angles, distance, flat or wedge)

Hey. Appreciate the post

 

However you misunderstood - after correcting my technique - there is no pain at all anymore even after 6 hours of riding:)

I ride regular. I have 60 degrees in front with lift under toes and a little cant  pushing knee to the right. I have 55 degree on rear foot with lift under heel and cant pushing knee to left. I'm 167.7 cm tall. And bindings are 48.2cm apart. I just started riding hardboots a few weeks ago. 

 

 

Edited December 27, 2020 by Tddragon

[Kneel]

On 12/13/2020 at 3:19 PM, Terryw said:

Just want to give a nod to Beckmann AG here...

http://beckmannag.com/hardboot-snowboarding/hardboot-binding-configuration

 

 

Amen.  My rear foot's outer ball of the transverse arch caught my brain asleep in the lift line early this season bitching about why it was doing all the work today while the inner was just floating there inside the boot. The inner ball said "Duh, because I can't. Never could.", told my heel to rotate out slightly past 60 degrees and like magic it was where it should be molded into the footbeds.  My brain wouldn't have permitted that.  "Front foot ALWAYS steeper than back foot. preposterous to think about back foot steeper and front foot. This is how we've always done it." it says.  Whelp, here I am riding 60F/62R and everyone is really happy.  It's right there in the link to try, but seemed taboo in the past.  Thanks @Beckmann AG for giving me permission to try something different.

[Beckmann AG]

^Kneel,

You're welcome. Glad you found the information useful.

[BlueB]

1 hour ago, Beckmann AG said:

^Kneel,

Rise a knight!