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AT ski boots for plates?

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Howdy all- I was wondering if this was a possibility?  I rode race boards and plates with ski boots starting in the late 80's (Burton Safari 185 with Lange ski boots) all the way up through the early 2000's with Bomber TD1's and Raichle/DeeLux on Volkl boards and everything in between.  These days it's either softies on BX/AM boards or tele-skiing, with a bit of traditional alpine thrown in.  None of my old boots fit anymore (amazed at what I used to do to my feet for "performance", and am paying for it now) but I wouldn't mind getting back on a race board now and then.  Alpine boots always slipped a little between the bails, so I am interested to see if AT boots are any better.  Any experience with this would be appreciated.  I will not buy hard boots for a few times per year, but I could use the AT boots for some two-planking.  

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I was impressed by the weight of the Atomic Hawx which had soles which looked touring oriented and also the holes for technical (?) bindings up front. The backland looks interesting too. I guess I need to find someone who's ridden them. 

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3 hours ago, lonbordin said:

There's a sub cult around the latest Atomic Backlands for splitboarding and hardbooting.

Correct, allegedly they are the best thing to happen to split boarding since the voile split kits. 

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2 hours ago, bobdea said:

Correct, allegedly they are the best thing to happen to split boarding since the voile split kits. 

I might even have a pair... And might be waiting for a certain someone to make bts springs for them... (Shhhh).

3 hours ago, philw said:

I was impressed by the weight of the Atomic Hawx which had soles which looked touring oriented and also the holes for technical (?) bindings up front. The backland looks interesting too. I guess I need to find someone who's ridden them. 

http://splitboard.com/talk/topic/atomic-backlands-thoughts-on-mods/page/4/

 

Edited by lonbordin
@pokkis has been WAY ahead of the pack here...

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Yeah, I'm surprised there are very few people riding in AT boots. Variety is huge nowadays. I had a pair of Garmont Shoguns that were every bit as stiff as my freerise ski boots, but had better soles and were lighter. I like the old Raichle 123 for teaching, they are very soft, somewhat heavy though. 

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50 minutes ago, BlueB said:

Yeah, I'm surprised there are very few people riding in AT boots. Variety is huge nowadays. I had a pair of Garmont Shoguns that were every bit as stiff as my freerise ski boots, but had better soles and were lighter. I like the old Raichle 123 for teaching, they are very soft, somewhat heavy though. 

They tend to be loooooong, no intec, people don’t know what they are.

i like the weight of AT boots and I REALLY like the vibram on the bottoms! 

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Yes, they were 10mm longer then my (stubby) ski boots. That didnt bother me much, as I'm only mondo 26.5. Vibram is great, though. What I didn't like much was severe forward lean in locked position. I had to drill an extra hole in the locking plate of the front boot. 

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Just bought the Backland NC model (no carbon) and soon it will be on the snow with the Drupi Spring System.
I've always promoted AT boots (lighter, forward flex, vibram soles) for snowboard and for freeride/off piste I used Scarpa or La Sportiva boots but now I think the Backland is better to be used with a spring system.

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my long beloved nordica SBH (TR9 AT boot w/cuff hinge flex) were my back country and alpine for many years,still going. I now use sccarpa pegasus(softer maistale) because they are soooooooo much lighter with wayyyyyy more stride ROM; I choose not to modify them to try and make them flex like a soft boot because I don't like the flex of soft boots and I want to use them for skiing.

16510974113_b13c8973cc_b.jpg

I did use these inbounds on 26cm wide boards, they're a bit stiff, backboot always in walk mode,

but the shorter BSL, more progreessive and lateral flex, and STEPIN COMPATIBILITY

of my old raichle sb's sent me to new free69s still using my 25yrold stepin Nitros

 

Edited by b0ardski

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Interesting. I don't want (like that linked thread) to try to make AT boots perform like soft boots - in fact any tendency to behave that way would make me not use the things. My focus would be the other way around - can I make them perform like hard snowboard boots.

I assume the point about lean is that some of these won't "go upright enough" for front-foot use without modification. For me it's pretty much about not riding 20 year old gear/ getting the benefits of more modern design.

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3 hours ago, philw said:

Interesting. I don't want (like that linked thread) to try to make AT boots perform like soft boots - in fact any tendency to behave that way would make me not use the things. My focus would be the other way around - can I make them perform like hard snowboard boots.

I assume the point about lean is that some of these won't "go upright enough" for front-foot use without modification. For me it's pretty much about not riding 20 year old gear/ getting the benefits of more modern design.

@pokkis was an early adopter and made his own spring system so he's probably da'man to talk to about Hardbooting the Backlands.

PS- You just won't believe how light these boots are... Crazy.

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There is lot of good stuff about Backlands with pics in this thread

https://www.extremecarving.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=13406

They are freaking light, but what best they are like sneakers when you walk/hike. And with good spring system they are lighter than with original walk/lock system.

Edited by pokkis
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My first pair of non-Alpine hard boots were Koflach's that had seen one trip up Mt. Blanc.  I was always jealous of the neon Koflach's Damien Sanders rode (and jealous of his wife also).  Funny post about the Nordica SHB's- they sent me 2 pair of those and 3 pair of the SBS's to play with back in the day.  The SBS's in a plate binding were an experience to say the least.  Thanks for all the info on AT boots y'all- I may head that direction.

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19 hours ago, pokkis said:

Backlands have same length as hardboots.

Oooooooooooh!! Wow! 

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On 1/3/2019 at 12:49 PM, pokkis said:

There is lot of good stuff about Backlands with pics in this thread

https://www.extremecarving.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=13406

They are freaking light, but what best they are like sneakers when you walk/hike. And with good spring system they are lighter than with original walk/lock system.

I'm looking for something which weighs less than conventional hard boots, and certainly modern AT Carbon boots do that. I read that thread but I'm not sure I get all of it.

Dumb question time:

  1. Can't I just buy those boots, buy some old-fashioned clip (not Intec) F2 bindings, and that should work? Back in the way we used ski boots that way, so these ought to simply work, right?
  2. Those chaps are adding after-market spring systems... and from the thread, they're doing it to stiffen up the response of those boots. Is that correct?
  3. Anyone got links to suppliers of spring systems and maybe instructions/ posts on how to set them up?

I'm just thinking that I don't like being jealous of my skiing mates with their modern boots, when I'm stuck on designs from 30 years ago. Even the .951 is a retro design...

 

----

Oh yeah, last week I rode with a couple of L4 instructors, one snowboard one ski. The snowboard guy was discussing his own intention to ride hard gear more. The ski lady asked me "what the down side of hard gear was". I assumed that was because she'd not seen me demonstrate one. My answer was the weight of the boots, which you have to carry in hand-baggage (because you easily replace them in North America). I think I'm officially sufficiently annoyed to actually fix this.

 

49294751_10215843079421747_6342142717241

 

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12 minutes ago, philw said:
  1. Can't I just buy those boots, buy some old-fashioned clip (not Intec) F2 bindings, and that should work? Back in the way we used ski boots that way, so these ought to simply work, right?
  2. Those chaps are adding after-market spring systems... and from the thread, they're doing it to stiffen up the response of those boots. Is that correct?
  3. Anyone got links to suppliers of spring systems and maybe instructions/ posts on how to set them up?

@philw 

1) There is to be room in F2 bails and that's why those in the thread are looking at other bindings.  You might look at other bindings as well as there's a lot of weight to be saved from F2s for the soft stuff you look to ride.

2) They are looking at a way to ride without being locked in in ride mode.  Once the ride lever is down the boots are stiff.  The spring system allows you to play with the stiffness and the amount of cuff travel the boot will be allowed to make.

3) @DRUPI apparently makes a system for the boot.  The attachment is as simple as two hex screws.

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Thanks.

A couple of hex screws I can manage, but maybe I'll be fine with the stock boots - they're probably more flexible than the Dynafit 3F Comp S boots I learned to board in 😉 Sounds promising.

@DRUPI I will talk to separately, once I find a UK source for the boots.

I shall report back should I go this way...

Edited by philw
Correctly spell Dynafit! (not Synafit!)

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9 minutes ago, philw said:

A couple of hex screws I can manage, but maybe I'll be fine with the stock boots - they're probably more flexible than the Synafit 3F Comp S boots I learned to board in 😉 Sounds promising.

In case a visual helps... here's the locking mechanism on my boots. The top part is held on by two screws.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/DjW67438HmZ8UvYy7

As you can see when it's down the only movement will come from shell deflection... so imagine riding with a (very light) stiff pair of ski boots... I'm guessing you'd go running for the Synafit's. 😁

Edited by lonbordin
Yup 29.5 shell with BSL of only 318!!!!

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For me Backlands are way too stiff for pow in ride mode, and way too soft in walk mode. Due this i have added simple spring system to be able have proper floex for riding which allows also nice walking capability. Friend of mine made spring system which has also walk option, but i did not needed it. Backland is nice boot for adding springs due system can be installed with same screws as original wal/ride system.

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8 hours ago, philw said:

Thanthey're probably more flexible than the Dynafit 3F Comp S boots I learned to board in 😉

That's funny, I learned to ride in 2Fs. 👍

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I'm very interested in this.  I rode Nordica SBH's for years.  So, will the Atomics fit correctly into F2's with no modification?  In locked mode, flex without springs compare to any of the other hardboot models out there now?  Roberto, is this a 3rd spring system you make on top of the two other systems that are to be used with either UPZ or Deeluxe? 

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