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15 Year Old wants to start on an Alpine setup


Guest Thomas_S

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Guest thomas_m

When I first started loking for an all mountain board for my wife (100lbs) I called Prior since I have a 4WD that I like. They told me the standard 4WD 159 is made for someone weighing around 150lbs. So, I'm guessing it will be be too stiff for you.

You should probably look at teh Oxygen SX boardercross board mentioned above. The 157cm is rated from 40kg -75kg. Also the smaller sized F2 Speedcross starts around 40kg.

I think the Speedcross looks like a great option.

Thomas_M

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Originally posted by Thomas_S

Not really. I already eat well. I am also a long distance runner, which is an endurance sport. You lose whatever is too much in your training. Running sixty(60) miles a week at a good pace will do that.

I admire young distance runners. Keep yourself healthy and I'll see you at an Ironman some year. I'm 90% certain I'll run the Badwater Ultra next year.....

Alright, I'll be blunt again.

If you can't get the Axis or the 4x4 on the used market, there are several "boardercross" boards that might do the trick. Start an ebay search and try to track down a older Volkl Cross. But...this really opens another can of worms b/c the width starts getting pretty wide....and you'll lose that lovin carvin feelin. This is the part where you might be better served on (2) different boards. As Derf mentions, older alpine decks are nearly given away and stiff freestyle decks have turned into a comodity.

My guess of budget

Carve----

ebay Burton FP board - $100

ebay Snowpro bindings - $75

Fin's Rachel 413 boots - $150

Freeride----

ebay Rossi Seone or Levitation - $75

ebay Burton Freestyle bindings - $75

www.the-house.com any POS boot - $75

total Budget - $550

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Kent

you kinda throw that "POS" term around a bit much. Just because a board isnt brand new, didnt cost full price, etc, doesnt mean its a piece of poo. The way you used that term in your first response was a bit abrasive dontcha think?

what about a burton speed then? those seem like theyd be a fairly good all around board, and they routinely show up on ebay...too stiff?

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Originally posted by D-Sub

Kent

you kinda throw that "POS" term around a bit much. Just because a board isnt brand new, didnt cost full price, etc, doesnt mean its a piece of poo. The way you used that term in your first response was a bit abrasive dontcha think?

what about a burton speed then? those seem like theyd be a fairly good all around board, and they routinely show up on ebay...too stiff?

I agree with the first paragraph, with a small distinction: I think POS to him is a Burton Alp/Wire/Coil or any other that is not popular here. My first board was a Freesurf Highlander that I paid 100$CAN new, not a POS in my opinion, just not for me. I sold it and then bought a Nitro GTX, other brand/model unpopular here, but I am very satisfied. Several people here like Rossignol, but I personnaly would never trust a board with a foam core (if they are still like this). And about the Oxygen Dave is selling, I'm not sure if it has one. I know the older FR series had wood cores (but were too soft), and I read on their site that the ones replacing them had foam cores (or something similar).

About the second paragraph, I never rode a Speed, I though it was like a FP, but after reading several posts, I think it is a little more like a UP. Maybe a bit stiff for someone who weights 106 lbs.

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Originally posted by D-Sub

Kent

you kinda throw that "POS" term around a bit much. Just because a board isnt brand new, didnt cost full price, etc, doesnt mean its a piece of poo. The way you used that term in your first response was a bit abrasive dontcha think?

what about a burton speed then? those seem like theyd be a fairly good all around board, and they routinely show up on ebay...too stiff?

You're making assumptions. I never said cost or being brand new had anything to do with it.

Burton Speed? Good for newbie racer/carver, bad for all around board.

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Guest Thomas_S

Ok, I've been looking around, and reading up on some of the boards recommended here.

Over at klugriding.com, they have a brand new '98 Burton Alp 151, 157, and 164 for $160.

I guess my question is, would it be wise to purchase an Alp, use it, and get started carving? Then, sell it later, after I have managed to get carving for a while?

Also, I will be keeping my current soft boot setup for other terrain, etc.

Kent: You ultra-marathoners are insane. Good luck to you though. Maybe one day I'll have gotten the ultra bug. :D

For now though, the 5000m and 10000m will have to do. Sad though that HS doesn't run the 10k in XC, or either in track. :(

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the one thing to think about with Burton is that youre limited in your binding selection. Burton only. Catek will fit 3 hole, too, but thats about it as far as I know.

man...where's that guy from last year that was selling all the Oxygen boards? dude had MANY boards on ebay!

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Thomas,

Consider that there is absolutely no reason why you can't carve on soft boots and a freeride board. In fact you should be able to put down gorgeous arcs in the snow on any burton freeride/freestyle board with soft boots on. And in many ways its more rewarding since it takes a very deft touch to do it. Granted you can't do it on plate ice (can't bust through) nor can you get as "low" on regular groomed slopes). Which is a bit of a mute point anyway for few on hardbooters can do that for very long (get rad bomber low) before their legs turn to rubber and they are back in the lodge. Yes, there is the extreme carving style, which does not load your legs as heavily, but noone here accepts that style of riding and they put great effort into discreditting it every chance they get (even if it takes bogus board reviews to do it). Probably because of the very high skill level required to do it.

So if you don't have the bucks just go back onto the slopes next month believing that "it can be done" on softboots. All you really need to do is read this article. That's all you need for now. And if you find you carve and you carve damn well, then make the investment later on because this game is definitely for you.

http://www.bomberonline.com//articles/feel_the_carve.cfm

Sic

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Originally posted by Neil Gendzwill

Yeah, but he can get some Race Plates cheap off ebay or somewhere and they won't be a problem at all with his weight. I think the alp/race plate setup would be a fine choice.

not like it matters what I say, but, agreed:)

its just...finding a 4hole board/binding combo would be more convenient due to interchangeability. thats all.

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Originally posted by sic t 2

Thomas,

Consider that there is absolutely no reason why you can't carve on soft boots and a freeride board.

he's got an absolute point.

Im gonna ignore the other crap, because its just that...crap. no one here tries to discredit anything, and the board review in question had NOTHING to do with bomber

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Guest Thomas_S

I did spend the majority of last years season working up to making the full switch to hardboots. I could probably recite "The Norm I and II" in my sleep.

Do not try and make me look like a fool sic t 2. I understand the costs involved, both financially and time, in switching over to a hardboot setup. Believe me, I would not be doing this if I did not.

It is a challenge that I am ready, and willing to accept. Although this only occured after my understanding the sacrifices to be made.

Yet do not think I don't appreciate your thoughs on this matter, because I do. Everyone's. I thank you all for helping me, even though I am no doubt starting to annoy you all.

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youre not annoying anyone, man

the dude had a point tho...with a proper "regular" board and good soft boots one _can_ certainly lay some damn good carves

but...Id be willing to be that youre already there?

as for putting together an all alpine setup and "sacrifices"...if you look at a hard setup as a specialized tool, and apply it in proper situations, no real sacrifice is being made.

in any case...I think I sent you an email about the boots I have for sale...theyre not the newest bestest but for your size and weight theyd probably work great. I didnt hear back from you but maybe you took a look at the auction.

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Guest Thomas_S

Thanks D-Sub. I thought I replied back. But, after looking through my sent messages, it turns out I didn't. Sorry! I accidentally hit save. Anyhow, I don't know how good those would be for me. Do they offer a lot of support, as my ankles are kind of weak?

On another note: I talked to Sean over at Donek. He was very helpful, and we considered a few possibilities. One was a 153 McMillen Slalom. He feels that it would be a nice board to start on for an alpine setup, and it will be able to serve me well if I ever decide to start racing(which would not be this year, thats for sure).

Sean's eMail:

[Given your weight and size, I actually wouldn't recommend either of the

boards you selected. We've had most luck putting young riders like yourself

into slalom setups for a first board. Many of these riders wind up racing

or freecarving on a slalom board until they gain a bit more weight and

become very comfident with the new stance and controling their edge. There

are a number of boards in the 153cm to 160cm size range that should be

excellent choices for you. If you give me a call we can discuss your needs

and experience and find one that will help you make the transition smoothly

and be a board you'll enjoy riding for a long time.

Note: Just plucked out the relevant part.

Now, heres the kicker. $550. Whoa. Now, if I were to go with this, some things would have to be done. For instance, I'd have to go with some used bindings, and definitely used boots. Although, after a quick search I found:

D-Sub's Burton Earth boots on eBay. Need to find out about how much support they offer, though.

Bindings? Looking for a used pair of Cateks or Trench Diggers. Quick question. What are the major quality differences between the two manufacturers?

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hmmm...support...well...theyre hard boots, so...ankles are pretty much taken out of the equation for the most part, no?

those boots I have would be considered "soft" compared to modern hardboots. Not soft like soft boots but not as stiff and rigid as say Raichle AFs...

but...honestly...I rode in them and got by, and I weigh 200

BUT...they are NOT stepin compatible, so...if you wanted Intec or FAST stepins, these wont work

theyd work with the burton rat trap types though...

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Originally posted by Thomas_S

Looking for a used pair of Cateks or Trench Diggers. Quick question. What are the major quality differences between the two manufacturers?

Thomas, Thomas, Thomas....

You must stay the course here! Fin and Jeff make great products, but have NO business being on someone your size. If you love Fin (like we all do), just buy some of his X-Bones. Just too stiff.

The binding choice is easy...Burton Race or SnowPro Race. That's it, don't consider anything else w/o prior approval from your elders. ;)

Back to the board. Dude...you're making this purchase waaaaay too difficult on yourself. It now seems that you're more concerned about a race deck than a all-mountain stick. Which, BTW, is fine. Personally, I'd buy a "nice" SL deck and call it a day.....

Heck, here's your board....

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=21250&item=7105582699&rd=1

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Guest Thomas_S

Kent, Kent, Kent

I never said I was going to race, thats just the board recommended to be by Sean Martin over at Donek. I also said "If I were to ever" :D Thats just whay he told me. Five hundred though? Nah. Thats just way too expensive. I just wanted to get some opinions regarding that. Re-reading my post, my thoughts are definitaly slanted against the Donek.

My original intentions haven't changed, they just became more informed.

Now, the Bindings: The reason I jumped to that was because I wasn't too impressed with the craftsmanship on the Burtons, from just looking at the pictures of them over at klugriding.com

Look at it this way:

Running 90 miles a week while building a base in the summer is insane on a pair of shoes, when most last only for about 300-400miles, unless you stumble upon a good pair. So I decide to go to K-Mart and get four pairs of $20 shoes instead of 1 $100+ pair. Cheaper in the long run, right? They'll last the same amount of time, too! So I go out on a ten miler and find out, half way through when it starts raining that the glue is water-soluble! (Stolen from Running with the Buffalos, paraphrased, of course).

I really hadn't looked past that quality viewpoint, especially not on the stiffness part.

That, and from what I've read, the Carriers are prone to breaking. Some Races were also recalled for breaking, too. So the quality control kind of scared me away from their bindings. Thoughts?

Ok, with an Alp:

What length? 151, 157, or 164? Narrowed down. $160. I can take that.

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I think the issue with burtons breaking was with heavier people. At your weight and size, the forces you will be imparting on this board will be nowhere near the forces I would impart, or even less so than someone my size who rides extremely aggressively

note:

when I first started carving, I rode a burton PJ7, with standard burton plates.

I had that board for 8 years. I rode it a LOT the first season, and then moderately after that, always hitting as hard as my skills allowed, and I even spent a lot of time in the air, trees, riding rainbows, etc

the bindings never broke on me! I had a release or two, but that was when I kept the toe bails lifted for easy release. my bad.

BUT:

If you choose an ALP...your choices for bindings are limited to TWO. Burton or Catek

oh..and..those alps at klugriding are from what...98 was it? 97? Personally I think you should be patient (no snow til december really anyway!) and hold out for another board with a 4hole pattern.

and if you dont like burton bindings...check out the SnowPro Kent mentioned. They have a decent reputation.

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Guest thomas_m

Thomas_S,

I have an Oxygen Proton 147(an SL board) that you can have for $50 including shipping if you want it. The weight range is about 90-140lbs.

The topsheet is a little scuffed but the board has never been ridden. I originally got it for my wife who weighs about the same as you but she ended up wanting a wider all-mountain ride.

Thomas_M

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Originally posted by D-Sub

If you choose an ALP...your choices for bindings are limited to TWO. Burton or Catek

That's not true. My Bomber TD1's seem to stay attached to my Alp 169 pretty well. ;) You've just got to make sure they have the disks that look like this: http://www.bomberonline.com/store/bindings/parts_td1_disk.cfm

I got them from the classifieds here for around $150 shipped - cheaper than many new bindings of lesser quality. You don't have as many stance width choices with TD1's and the Burton 3D pattern as you do with a 4x4 pattern.

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Thomas_S,

I'm also very light (although heavier than you) and I have an Alp 57 w/ Race bindings. I got the whole thing on ebay toward the middle of the season. I feel quite secure in them. I think most pepole agree that they are fine for lighter riders. Now the Burton Universal cant sort of stinks. I'm not sure if Burton only has a universal cant or if they have fixed cants. And the Burton Race, generally speaking, isnt' even in the same league as Catek or TDs, but I personally don't need to start off on the highest quality stuff, not while I'm still a carving newb anyway. I'd rather ride the hell out of my board now, usually a person knows when they're ready to move up.

I don't know when your season starts, but if you order the board from klugriding, it'll be there in a few days. The Alps aren't expensive, but personally I would try to go with something used for your first setup, as long as it is in decent condition. Inevitably, like everyone here, you will fall in love with carving and want to upgrade. Pay particular attention to the boots, though. Boots that dont' fit properly really stink. Of all the things to buy new, I would go with the boots. They have a very reasonable return policy here on Bomber, too.

Check raceboarders.com ebay link frequently for at least a few more weeks. Also, though the chances of success on this are likely limited, try your local shops to see if they have any old boards lying around.

good luck!

---

Barry

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