Marijuana law reform?

[Gecko]

plant in the forest....

[D-Sub]

It stinks too much. Besides, while CO law is pretty relaxed on mj, growing plants is a significant jump in penalty.

you sure about that? growing a couple? as long as you do not seem to be selling?

also...from what I've seen...it doesn't smell THAT strong while growing

and yes, I meant outdoors somewhere.

hey...curious...do you ever see something called Paonia Paralyzer?

[D-Sub]

me either. My mom lives there and told me about it once. neither of us smokes, but I thought it was funny that she knew about a "brand" of weed from her area.

Lots of hippies there. Idiot hippies.

[Terryw]

It is interesting to see all of the interest in this subject recently. Happy to see so many positive posts. It is in the news recently that the most recent field poll in Ca showed that for the first time, 54% of the poll responders felt that marijuana should be legal and taxed like alcohol and cigarettes. We are finally approaching a super majority. Suddenly our Govenator who used weed through the 70's, has agreed that we need to open up the debate. 8 weeks ago he said he would not consider the issue, let alone think about signing a law like this. Lets hope the wave continues to build.

[Gecko]

Cali want to legalize it

[b0ardski]

It will be very interesting to see what organization/s conduct the study; if it's any organization with ties to the republican party or pharmosuetical companies we already know the answer:(

The savings from enforcement, incarceration, prosecution and resulting loss of income is a boon to the economy even before adding in tax revenues.

[Gecko]

As I said above someplace, I read that the probable contribution to the California economy is of legalized MJ farming is 14 billion dollars... though that would have to be a national legalization I can't see that figure being raised on californians alone. I don't think Pharm companies are gonna be able to control it right off the bat I think it will start out as Aggro maybe big tobacco, I think we are destined to have it controlled by BATF not FDA

[Terryw]

Call for studies is just double speak. Those studies have all ready been done. Repeatedly. I believe that the politicians are just waiting for enough of the population to become aware enough to actually care about this issue so that there is an overwhelming majority of actual voters to force the issue. If 60% of real voters are clamoring for this, then the politician can wring his hands to privatized prisons and big pharma and say "What can I do? the people have forced me to sign this. It would be political suicide to oppose a super majority." I think there might be a lot more politicians who suddenly see the light when they realize that they can support this issue and not lose support for their next election. One can only hope. In any true debate where the facts are brought to light, most people will agree that the pro positionn makes sense. If we can just educate enough of the population, legislation will follow.

[D-Sub]

you know what's kinda funny?

my stance is that some really, really, really sick stuff is happening in America politically. I won't go into it but a few are in agreement with me here.

DRUGS are part of the sedation that allows these things to continue to happen. Why do people drink so much? Escape. Smoke? Escape. Shoot up? Escape.

Some say weed awakens us, englightens us. I don't buy it.

So I find it kinda contradictory that on one hand I am screaming WAKE THE HELL UP, PEOPLE while at the same time...well hang on...I'm not advocating the use of drugs, just arguing that I'm tired of Leviathan jailing people for it.

Hey...I just solved my own moral dilemma! Nice! :)

[b0ardski]

weed awakens??? who says that???

"DRUGS are part of the sedation that allows these things to continue to happen." So If we all stop smoking & drinking things will change????

Go back to prohibition of alcohol & we will have a revolution.

If the peacenic potheads fought back with machine guns like the alcoholics did in the '30s the prohibition on it would be lifted, Like thats gonna happen:rolleyes:

In the age of sattelite survailence & drones, it's too late for revoultion.

ps these are mearly opinions, take them with a grain of salt

[D-Sub]

Wow, that's not something I've ever heard before. I agree, I don't think either of those two words work.

If you've never heard the notion that pot smoking enlightens the smoker, well...you're either not paying attention or aren't around pot smokers much, OR maybe the smokers you know just take it for what it's worth, an intoxicant, and don't attach mystical qualities to it.

[D-Sub]

weed awakens??? who says that???

A lot of people. You only need one question mark, friend.

"DRUGS are part of the sedation that allows these things to continue to happen." So If we all stop smoking & drinking things will change????

I didn't say anything of the sort, BUT, yes. If people focused on personal growth and introspection instead of numbing themselves, we could (I did not say would) improve as a whole.

Go back to prohibition of alcohol & we will have a revolution.

Yes, I know. Again...you're literally "putting words in my mouth here" making inferences that I did not make. I am not arguing for prohibition and am trying to figure out where you got that notion.

If the peacenic potheads fought back with machine guns like the alcoholics did in the '30s the prohibition on it would be lifted, Like thats gonna happen

actually, very few people "fought back" during the prohibition except for mobsters and runners.

I'm all for revolution though. The jackasses have been jerking us around for far too long. Not all stoners are hippies though, but weed doesn't exactly inspire aggressive behavior.

In the age of sattelite survailence & drones, it's too late for revoultion.

It's never too late.

ps these are mearly opinions, take them with a grain of salt

done.

[D-Sub]

Yeah, I've never attached any mystical connotation to it, nor have anyone I've known. Hanging with an odd group, D?;)

Not people I hang with. I fly solo. But, people I know or know of, especially Joe Rogan.

[bobdea]

http://www.yooouuutuuube.com/v/?rows=36&cols=36&id=B4pIxnuUG1k&startZoom=1

and

<object width="560" height="340"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-PwMmSxZANE&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-PwMmSxZANE&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="560" height="340"></embed></object>

at least Sinecure will get a laugh out of it!!!!

[D-Sub]

Only slightly related since commercial hemp is NOT an inebriant, but Ron Paul has introduced HR 1009 which will "allow" (wow...I have to ask permission?) citizens to farm hemp plant for commercial uses.

If you are not familiar without how flexible the hemp plant is, I urge you to do the research.

I am seriously considering growing hemp for income. It is incredibly easy to grow, requires very little maintenance, and is highly profitable.

[Terryw]

Is it not amazing that the paranoia about marijuana extends to hemp? While I am reluctant to trumpet anecdotal experience like that of Rick Simpson, I do believe that hemp in general is an incredibly valuable resource that should be produced and sold.

And for the record, I don't really believe that big pharma is secretly fighting the use of marijuana. There are many patents held by both the Government and big pharma. If mj were legal tomorrow, they would both start to make money on it. I think of it the way I think about willow bark. It is the extract of the willow bark that is used to make asprin. While you could just boil the bark to make a tea for free, most people just take the pill because it is simpler. I think that many people would just purchase from big paharma because they trust them and it is convenient. Just human nature. Just my thughts on it ....

[bobdea]

yes, kinda.

the big companies do like patentable drugs, sometimes once their patent expires they even stop making the stuff. the companies that make the generics would probably be all over it though

[Petrol]

sheer nonsense.

decriminalize ALL drugs for personal use. Screw taxes. We're taxed enough already....

PLUS, literally thousands of people jailed for NOTHING. No victim, no damages, no NOTHING...

While I agree that we are already Taxed MORE then enough, there exists no where near enough Personal responsibility amongst far to many members of our society to even joke about legalization of currently illegal drugs of abuse.

btw, I also disagree with any assertions that there are "no victims, damages, etc."

[Petrol]

funny you should say that about the netherlands, their biggest problem since making the herb and a few others legal is ....

and an even larger population of socialist welfare dependants.... ;)

[D-Sub]

While I agree that we are already Taxed MORE then enough, there exists no where near enough Personal responsibility amongst far to many members of our society to even joke about legalization of currently illegal drugs of abuse.

right, so...PUT THEM IN JAIL! TAKE AWAY THEIR POSSESSIONS! RUIN THEIR FAMILIES! THEY SMOKED SOME POT!

cmon.

btw, I also disagree with any assertions that there are "no victims, damages, etc."

Not sure who said that. I certainly didn't. I know first hand what hard drugs can do to people.

Except...that stuff happened regardless of laws. Laws very rarely, if ever, prevent behavior.

[bobdea]

and an even larger population of socialist welfare dependants.... ;)

wow, retard quote of the day.

the amount of money saved by not sending people to jail for various drug offenses is huge, actually costs half as much to put someone on full welfare benefits here than lock them up for a year not to mention the cost on the actual judicial system to put them in jail.

Then, often when one parent goes to jail the other ends up on welfare anyway....

watch the William Buckley video on youtube, IMO he's dead on. It's a right wing idea, cheaper than crowding jails.

[bobdea]

While I agree that we are already Taxed MORE then enough, there exists no where near enough Personal responsibility amongst far to many members of our society to even joke about legalization of currently illegal drugs of abuse.

btw, I also disagree with any assertions that there are "no victims, damages, etc."

so I take it that no one should be able to have a gun either?

You're talking the same line the people who think that no one should be able have a gun for any reason talk.

They say people are not responsible enough and talk about people having accidents.

Want to ban cars too?

[Terryw]

While I agree that we are already Taxed MORE then enough, there exists no where near enough Personal responsibility amongst far to many members of our society to even joke about legalization of currently illegal drugs of abuse.

btw, I also disagree with any assertions that there are "no victims, damages, etc."

No joke, I take this issue very seriously. To me, this is a matter of the greatest good for the most people. Literally thousands of people are killed each year because of the war on drugs. Many of them were innocent bystanders simply in the wrong place at the wrong time. When was the last time you saw or heard of a shoot out over the delivery of whisky or gin? 50,000 people a year die from alcohol poisoning. 400,000 deaths a year are attributed to tobacco. These are completely legal. No one has ever died from overdosing on marijuana, ever. Now you tell me which drug makes more sense. Does that mean that drug use comes without consequences? Of course not. I am only arguing that we save and help way more of our society by eliminating proibition than we do by enforcing the curent law of the land which destroys more lives than the drugs ever did.

[Petrol]

wow, retard quote of the day.

yea, right. I think it's only retarded because You didn't comprehend what was wrote.

Fine, we save a couple bucks by not having to lock-up and house the many wacked out intoxicated idiots along side the very responsible pot-heads (we know they all are very resposible) who just seem to get caught up in a perverse system of mis-justice

wtf, I'm sure they all, as are all jellies, otherwise incrediably productive members of society

[Bullwings]

Not gonna happen.

As much as I'd like it to, i highly doubt it.

Pot is as harmless or even more so harmless than other crap you can get out there LEGALLY...

Anyone ever hear of 2CE, DPT, 2CI, salvia divanorem (sp?) 20x to 40x extract, ethanol (e.g. alcohol), tobacco, the list goes on and on? All of these drugs can be legally purchased on the internet/liquor store. Drug abuse is on the abuser, especially for something as minorly addictive as pot.

I've used it enough and for long enough to know that yes it is addictive, but it's also easy enough to stop too. Used it practically every single day throughout my last 2 years in college (up in smoke, can't really remember much of that time), but by the time graduation came, i knew i had to get a job, so, i quit cold turkey and got myself a job 2 months after graduation - also note, i graduated.... and not just barely either - though not exactly magna cum laude... I've used occasionally since then (see once every 1-4 months at a time).

As far as the gateway drug argument... LAME and unfounded. 87% of people who have smoked pot, ONLY try pot and stop there. Of course if you've used cocaine, E, heroine, etc. etc. you've obviously tried pot, and alcohol, and tobacco smoke....

Now as far as it getting legalized, well, a lot of these tax numbers aren't exactly solid. Yes, there have been articles touting all sorts of billions in revenue, but they're going off of estimates of how much of the drug is out there, which they really don't know. You can give like +/-50% error...

Anyway, there's all sorts of legal stuff out there that's addictive and can be harmful if done in excess. When done in moderation, they're normally fine - see gambling, sex, alcohol, video games, shopping, tobacco (questionable... but still legal). Pot would easily fall under this category - of course if done in excess, it'll cause problems, like most anything.

Point to be made - pot is not harmful in moderation, it can be in excess. Law enforcement wastes lots of money on it for the dumbest reason. It's probably not as lucrative a taxable item as proponents think. It also probably won't ever be legalized just because... Also, don't get me going on possible legal medical uses, of which there really is potential... Don't get me wrong, but normally the ones against it are the prudes who've never done it, even just to try it (i could be wrong, though)...

Also, there's all sorts of wasted money on alcohol and tobacco too. Just ask the health industry and the taxes that go to paying for county hospital lung cancer patients, liver failure patients, heart disease patients, bladder cancer patients - all of whose incedence increased by using one or the other or both. Oh, and the taxes placed on those items to try to cover the cost - no where near enough...