bobble Posted January 17, 2009 Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 ..............you could damage the binding plate though. The only thing needed is to loosen the seized bolt.....somehow. The next - preventing it from happening again :D.Millen problem is both screws/bolts are stripped. thinking i don't have much of a choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Houghton Posted January 17, 2009 Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 No much risk in drilling off the heads as long as you stay centered and use a bit no larger than the minor thread diameter of the bolt. The remaining piece should come out easily. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdifan_2003 Posted January 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 problem is both screws/bolts are stripped. thinking i don't have much of a choice. Again as i said, work on either one of them and after that try to rotate the plate and the block, so the screw gets loosen. Good luck! Also, please somebody elaborate on the Loctite thing - apply and mount or apply and wait to dry out....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdifan_2003 Posted January 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 As a second thought - has anybody used Catek OS2 SHORT plates with Mo 28 boots? The are designed for "up to" MO 28, but as I see it - you have to mount the blocks on the LAST wholes in both front and back of the plates. Any danger about that? Thanks! Millen Yeah, yeah, I should be more on the board than just sitting here.......and I will Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gecko Posted January 17, 2009 Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 the issue with that is that you have no room for binding bias, not a problem on a wide board but on my narrow 18.8cm board my front and rear bindings are mounted a bit offset so that I can have the most relaxed angles possible and still have the toe and heel of my boots on the edge Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdifan_2003 Posted January 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 the issue with that is that you have no room for binding bias, not a problem on a wide board but on my narrow 18.8cm board my front and rear bindings are mounted a bit offset so that I can have the most relaxed angles possible and still have the toe and heel of my boots on the edge I do have space...........yet ;). My question was - is it safe to mount them on the last wholes? The bails are barely covered by the blocks....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jp1 Posted January 17, 2009 Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 bobble, assuming the HEX of the Allen Screw is stripped (rounded) and NOT the threads try this. Take a small hammer (round end of a Ball Pein will keep from damaging area around screw) and gently tap the 'mushroomed / raised' hex area of the screw back down flush with head of screw. This will 'close up' the hex. Now take the proper size allen key (make sure it is the proper size and the end is NOT rounded.) If it is, grind it flat like a new one OR get a new allen key. Hopefully you will have to 'tap' the allen wrench into the screw, line up the allen wrench in the hex and gently tap it in untill fully engauged. Then try backing it off as normal. When you get it out, Throw It Away. With Flathead Allen Screws, ANYTIME they start to show signs of rounding the best thing to do is throw them out & install new ones (cheap insurance). Here's what also works for me on Flatheads often, as long as the threads are not 'picked up'. ALWAYS, soak them in Penetrant as long as possible. In this case, you should be able to get it (Penetrant) up from the bottom. I'd fill up the holes from the bottom and leave them sit overnight. Then taking a sharp Center Punch, punch 1/2 way between the outer edge of the head of the screw and the allen key recess. First, straight down to get a good deep punch mark (this also 'shocks' the screw & threads). Now tilt punch on an angle and strike punch as to move the head of the screw in a counter-clockwise direction. If this don't work, like Chris H. stated, drilling the heads off 'should' be easy. The recessed hex will act as a guide. They are Stainless so they will be tough, use a good cutting fluid, slow speed lots of pressure. I'd still start with a center drill of the proper size & doing the drilling in a Drill Press would be advantageous (to keep it straight and controlled better) but not required. I always still drill all the way through the screw / bolt if possible (specially if it is going nice and straight). Then you have a good centered foundation to work from IF the screw does not come out as easily as you would hope. Very often when working your way up to a larger diameter, you will 'stick' the drill bit (it will grab) and you will walk the broken piece right out with the drill. I have also had luck using a regular drill bit and grinding the flutes as to cut when drilling counter clockwise (like a left hand drill bit) then when the drill bit 'sticks', it backs out the broken piece. Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gecko Posted January 17, 2009 Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 I do have space...........yet ;). My question was - is it safe to mount them on the last wholes? The bails are barely covered by the blocks....... I wouldn't expect that mounting on the end holes would be a problem though there will be flex. What I meant by Bias is that the toe block on the front binding is mounted further towards the front of the plate and further back on the rear binding Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobble Posted January 17, 2009 Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 bobble, assuming the HEX of the Allen Screw is stripped (rounded) and NOT the threads try this. Take a small hammer (round end of a Ball Pein will keep from damaging area around screw) and gently tap the 'mushroomed / raised' hex area of the screw back down flush with head of screw. This will 'close up' the hex. Now take the proper size allen key (make sure it is the proper size and the end is NOT rounded.) If it is, grind it flat like a new one OR get a new allen key. Hopefully you will have to 'tap' the allen wrench into the screw, line up the allen wrench in the hex and gently tap it in untill fully engauged. Then try backing it off as normal. When you get it out, Throw It Away. With Flathead Allen Screws, ANYTIME they start to show signs of rounding the best thing to do is throw them out & install new ones (cheap insurance).Here's what also works for me on Flatheads often, as long as the threads are not 'picked up'. ALWAYS, soak them in Penetrant as long as possible. In this case, you should be able to get it (Penetrant) up from the bottom. I'd fill up the holes from the bottom and leave them sit overnight. Then taking a sharp Center Punch, punch 1/2 way between the outer edge of the head of the screw and the allen key recess. First, straight down to get a good deep punch mark (this also 'shocks' the screw & threads). Now tilt punch on an angle and strike punch as to move the head of the screw in a counter-clockwise direction. If this don't work, like Chris H. stated, drilling the heads off 'should' be easy. The recessed hex will act as a guide. They are Stainless so they will be tough, use a good cutting fluid, slow speed lots of pressure. I'd still start with a center drill of the proper size & doing the drilling in a Drill Press would be advantageous (to keep it straight and controlled better) but not required. I always still drill all the way through the screw / bolt if possible (specially if it is going nice and straight). Then you have a good centered foundation to work from IF the screw does not come out as easily as you would hope. Very often when working your way up to a larger diameter, you will 'stick' the drill bit (it will grab) and you will walk the broken piece right out with the drill. I have also had luck using a regular drill bit and grinding the flutes as to cut when drilling counter clockwise (like a left hand drill bit) then when the drill bit 'sticks', it backs out the broken piece. Good luck. excellent advice! i used a punch just like you said and freed a screw. couldn't believe how easy that was. thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdifan_2003 Posted January 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 18, 2009 excellent advice!i used a punch just like you said and freed a screw. couldn't believe how easy that was. thanks! Great feeling, right . Now what are you gonna replace the screw with ;)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jp1 Posted January 18, 2009 Report Share Posted January 18, 2009 Great feeling, right . Now what are you gonna replace the screw with ? Find a good Hardware Store or mail order a box of Stainless Steel M6 X 20mm Flat Head Allen Screws. When the head ( hex / allen recess) 'starts' to show signs of rounding, THROW IT OUT and install a new screw ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobble Posted January 18, 2009 Report Share Posted January 18, 2009 Great feeling, right . Now what are you gonna replace the screw with ?Find a good Hardware Store or mail order a box of Stainless Steel M6 X 20mm Flat Head Allen Screws. When the head ( hex / allen recess) 'starts' to show signs of rounding, THROW IT OUT and install a new screw ! bought M6 flathead screws from the hardware store. at some point i'll upgrade to the bomber screws. thanks everyone for the excellent advise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdifan_2003 Posted January 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 18, 2009 Great feeling, right . Now what are you gonna replace the screw with ?Find a good Hardware Store or mail order a box of Stainless Steel M6 X 20mm Flat Head Allen Screws. When the head ( hex / allen recess) 'starts' to show signs of rounding, THROW IT OUT and install a new screw ! Fine, that was actually my question. The M6 20mm screws I found are PH3, not allen and the heads are just a bit smaller/shallower and recess deeper into the blocks. Also, I am not sure that the head cup (\_/) angles are the same as the head cup of the blocks. Someone mentioned McMaster........... Also, since I am going to be ordering, I'll order 12 mm for mounting the disks with the D3. I still can't find the short M6 for the power plates . Millen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kimo Posted January 18, 2009 Report Share Posted January 18, 2009 I still can't find the short M6 for the power plates .Millen They're not listed on the website, but if you can get in touch with Jeff or Scott, they can get those to you. They got some to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdifan_2003 Posted January 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 18, 2009 They're not listed on the website, but if you can get in touch with Jeff or Scott, they can get those to you. They got some to me. Thanks! They will. I just wanted to know where else I could find them. Jeff and Scott are great but sometimes it takes a while to get them replying ;). Anyway, if I find them somewhere, I'll post. Millen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gecko Posted January 18, 2009 Report Share Posted January 18, 2009 yeah I have a note into them about tilt bolts I want two more long bolts so I can be level in the front Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdifan_2003 Posted January 20, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 yeah I have a note into them about tilt bolts I want two more long bolts so I can be level in the front I am looking at mine right now. The bolts are covered with something yellow. I guess, some sort of Loctite to prevent them from easy turning....... I ordered a second set of power plates and Jeff is sending me some spare screws. Now, together with the second disc set I bought last year, changing plates will be a whole lot easier :D. Millen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdifan_2003 Posted April 1, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 1, 2009 Bringing the Catek topic back. Has anyone experienced problems with heel bail falling down? When I got the plates, the heel bail was standing upright and there was no problem with clipping in the bindings. Now, after a while, it started to drop down and every time it takes more than a few attempts to clip the back of the boot to it. Catek doesn't have anything like, let's say Burton - a spring like thingy to keep the bail up. Any solutions? Other than that - last week at Vail was great (4 days of powder and 3 days on groomers - awesome) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Houghton Posted April 1, 2009 Report Share Posted April 1, 2009 Has the aluminum worn away from the bail being stepped on too many times, or is the bail just stretched wider (the rears are not welded I don't think). If so, maybe you can take the bail off and squash it back to the proper size in a vise? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
queequeg Posted April 1, 2009 Report Share Posted April 1, 2009 Now, a technical question - has anybody had troubles with stripping the hexes on ANY of the bolts supplied with the OS2s? Millen I've had trouble with the hex screws on the toe/heel block units as a consequence of galling. I noticed that the screws that come with the fintech heel reciever for the OS2's are less of an issue - I would try the aforementioned screw upgrade kit available from bomber for sure. No problem with the kingpin. The problem I have had (and seen/heard of from others) is with slippage between the power plate and the disc, on the front binding. Catek replaced my disc/power plate earlier this season, but the new plate exibited the same problem. I've heard of other people having the same problem and I think there's a post around here about the issue. If you're lucky enough to have a 60(deg) front angle then you can lock it in with two screws but otherwise I've had problems with slippage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeGogoussier Posted April 1, 2009 Report Share Posted April 1, 2009 (...) a spring like thingy to keep the bail up. Any solutions? A couple of crude mods are shown here: http://www.extremecarving.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1476&highlight=binding+modification Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
serge Posted April 1, 2009 Report Share Posted April 1, 2009 The problem I have had (and seen/heard of from others) is with slippage between the power plate and the disc, on the front binding. Catek replaced my disc/power plate earlier this season, but the new plate exibited the same problem. I've heard of other people having the same problem and I think there's a post around here about the issue. If you're lucky enough to have a 60(deg) front angle then you can lock it in with two screws but otherwise I've had problems with slippage. I had the same problem on my FR2 Pro.. power plate was slipping. I noticed that the head of the screw wore the power plate ... Never had the problem on the OS2s (it is my first season though). On the FR2, when I removed the plate, I notice the tilt screws were not tight... i could freely turn them easily enough, when untightening them to remove the plate. Looked at the plate.. and they were toast. I think you really have to tighten the king pin first.... and ensure that the tilt screws are raised ( I am assuming that your left/cant are already set) so that only the king pin screw is holding the plate, and not have the tilt screw resist. I leave a bit of ply so that I can wiggle the plate with just the king pin tightened. Now, tighten the tilt screws...with equal turns.... I usually do 1/4 turn at a time for each screw, and go diagonally... i.e. front left -> back right -> front right -> back left.... Unfortunately, I can't say how tight it should be, I just tighten it to feel. So, the king ping hold the plate down, but when you screw in the tilt screw, the force will push the power plate down onto the disc. I think that give more pressure onto the power plate.... Of course.. make sure the power plate screws are tight.. but not to tight , or you will strip them when removing them. Anyhow, hope this helps. Never saw the problem again in two seasons with the FR2 and 1 with the OS2, or maybe I just don't ride aggressively enough:) Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
queequeg Posted April 1, 2009 Report Share Posted April 1, 2009 I had the same problem on my FR2 Pro.. power plate was slipping. I noticed that the head of the screw wore the power plate ... Never had the problem on the OS2s (it is my first season though). On the FR2, when I removed the plate, I notice the tilt screws were not tight... i could freely turn them easily enough, when untightening them to remove the plate.Looked at the plate.. and they were toast. I think you really have to tighten the king pin first.... and ensure that the tilt screws are raised ( I am assuming that your left/cant are already set) so that only the king pin screw is holding the plate, and not have the tilt screw resist. I leave a bit of ply so that I can wiggle the plate with just the king pin tightened. Now, tighten the tilt screws...with equal turns.... I usually do 1/4 turn at a time for each screw, and go diagonally... i.e. front left -> back right -> front right -> back left.... Unfortunately, I can't say how tight it should be, I just tighten it to feel. So, the king ping hold the plate down, but when you screw in the tilt screw, the force will push the power plate down onto the disc. I think that give more pressure onto the power plate.... Of course.. make sure the power plate screws are tight.. but not to tight , or you will strip them when removing them. Anyhow, hope this helps. Never saw the problem again in two seasons with the FR2 and 1 with the OS2, or maybe I just don't ride aggressively enough:) Cheers Yeah ... I've tried a lot of different things (including what you suggest). Every time, they slip ... the only thing that has prevented it is to use two screws @ 60 degrees. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeGogoussier Posted April 1, 2009 Report Share Posted April 1, 2009 For a mechanically sound, stable and safe setup here is the sequence I use: 1) Screw the power plate down onto the disc using blue Loctite on the threads of the two screws. Use a decent T-handle 4mm hex key. 2) Place the binding plate on a flat surface and adjust the tilt screws to the desired lift/cant with all four tilt screws in contact with the flat surface. Ensure each has at least 3 threads into the binding plate. 3) With the king pin removed or just barely engaged into the spherical nut position the binding plate on top of the power plate, then fine tune one of the four tilt screws to stabilize the binding plate so it does not wiggle at all when you press it down by hand. 4) Put blue Loctite onto the king pin thread and screw it in using a decent T-handle 6mm hex key. Pull the binding plate up as you proceed; it keeps the spherical nut from turning. Torque the pin about 1/8 turn past the point where the binding plate first feels "set in". With a good quality hex tool you can apply quite a bit of force and not damage anything. This method (king pin last) ensures that the power plate does not get distorted (as may happen if the tilt screws are torqued individually). Such distortion could allow the power plate to slip under the screws that hold it down. Hope this helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobble Posted April 1, 2009 Report Share Posted April 1, 2009 Bringing the Catek topic back. Has anyone experienced problems with heel bail falling down? When I got the plates, the heel bail was standing upright and there was no problem with clipping in the bindings. Now, after a while, it started to drop down and every time it takes more than a few attempts to clip the back of the boot to it. Catek doesn't have anything like, let's say Burton - a spring like thingy to keep the bail up. Any solutions? Other than that - last week at Vail was great (4 days of powder and 3 days on groomers - awesome) happens to me alot. i've snapped a couple of toe bales at the weld too. i buy both rear and toe bales at the start of the season for spares. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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