Zeitgeist: the movie

[D-Sub]

Finally watched my copy. I cried multiple times. If you don't know what it is, please, just take a sec:

http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/statement.htm

downloads here: http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/dloads.htm

hard copy DVDs here: http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/dvdorder.htm

If you cant afford one, email me. I will make you a copy and mail it to you (this is allowed and encouraged by the person/people who produced it)

[D-Sub]

and if you want to go further

http://www.infowars.com/index.html

http://www.911truth.org/

there's more.

it all seems so crazy, because it is.

my only question is: who gains? People who want the truth exposed or those who want it kept hidden?

[Fleaman]

I don't know what it is about but I am d/l a torrent of it, I love conspiracies

[D-Sub]

this goes way beyond conspiracy.

9/11 was an inside job as have been most "terrorist" acts in america and elsewhere. We're cowed and submissive.

[canuckcarver]

wow im gonna need some time to digest all the info in that. and form an opinion. i agree with the religion part but, the political side is something else

[D-Sub]

It's a HUGE amount of info, and if one does what one should do, ie check the resources and citations, it's even more info, but the more you look into it the more you realize that there has been a concerted effort for quite some time now to manipulate the public, start wars, and instill fear all so these big groups can turn unheard of profits.

It's really quite sick. If this doesn't make you angry you just might be too far gone.

[utahcarver]

I've been studying this stuff for years and I have realized that most Americans are too fat and happy to listen or do anything about it. I'd like to think that all that it would take would be a national grassroots movement to counter this lawlessness. Sadly, like most things that are bad, it'll continue to get worse until people have to die to change anything.

I've wasted a lot of time talking to people about this stuff only to realize that they aren't going to fight until it's too late.

Mark

[D-Sub]

Well...Im not so sure its just fat and lazy, man. If these allegations were true...they go back much further than 9/11/2001. They go back hundreds of years...and the concept of the illuminati/masons...all that stuff might be true...fact is, thats a lot to comprehend and absorb. Too much, most likely. If there were a way to convince Americans that at the core their government was actually against them instead of protecting them, without needing to feed this immense amount of info to them, just somehow make them know the truth I think more than a few'd stand up and fight.

Fat, lazy and comfortable applies to a lot of us, but a good few just don't know what to do! I mean...to be honest...after watching zeitgeist or a movie like V for Vendetta or even Fight Club...I have this overwhelming urge to eradicate the enemy, but...Im no guerilla...I too have been cowed into submission and overcoming that is radically difficult.

[utahcarver]

...it's not just fat and lazy people.

If what Zeitgeist and others have said is true, you've got many people who aren't willing to be honest with themselves and see what is going on around them. They are not willing to admit that what they know and what they think is completely wrong regarding the history of the world. A non-popular perspective of history that challenges almost everything they've been taught in school, church and community is not very well accepted by active or lazy people.

Mark

[Scuff]

Whoa... This is good..... really good..

Thanks for posting!

[D-Sub]

I literally broke down crying when they replayed the phone message from the dude that was in one of the buildings right before it collapsed. that hit me very, very hard

again...the vid is available on DVD for $7 shipped. If anyone cant afford it I will make a copy and send them one. I hate watching stuff on my computer...

[bobdea]

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5547481422995115331

on gvid

I've not watched it yet and I really don't buy most of the 9/11 conspiracy theories but as I say that our government HAD to know something was up and I figure they let it happen so the administration could do whatever they wanted

9/11 was bush version of the reichstag fire

Most Americans are willing to follow whatever their news outlet of choice tells them (most of these are controlled by just a few corporations) regardless if it's cnn, fox or whatever they ALL (even PBS and NPR!) bow down to their corporate overlords because that either where their money comes from or they are directly owned by them

[trailertrash]

this thread reminds me of two quotes i read recently:

"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to reform (or pause and reflect)."

- Mark Twain, 1904

“When facism comes to America it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross.” Sinclair Lewis

[D-Sub]

“When facism comes to America it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross.” Sinclair Lewis

That applies to any nation-state. Extreme patriotism wrapped up on religious dogma. Certainly applies to the US currently.

[D-Sub]

bump

zeitgeist will be showing in LA saturday night as part of the artivists film festival

Info here

[Jack M]

we all believe exactly what we want to.

however many "facts" as are presented by one side, the other side can put up as many that conclude the exact opposite.

raise your hand if you watched the film FarenHype 911..... anybody? Bueller?

[D-Sub]

Sorry but farenhype 9/11 was nothing but whiny neo-cons trying to smear m. moore. Rebuttal? NOT

Zeitgeist is legit. I don't WANT to believe ANY of this, Jack. That is where you are wrong. Why would I want to believe it? Why would anyone?

[bobdea]

I am picky about Moore's movies too but truth be told there is allot wrong with our government and with the war in Iraq. Now it's seeming like a war with Iran is in the making too.

It's really sad that the only republican points out huge policy issues with the Bush administration and actually lives up to all the things the party claims to be is generally written off as a nutter. Ron Paul is what conservatism used to be 50 years ago and what the republican party needs to get back to. If they do I'd have allot less problems with the party.

The reason I am saying this is that our government is running in way that breeds these conspiracy theories because it's so secretive and that there is such widespread corruption that even sane people are starting to suspect everything.

[willywhit]

dude,

rerun, remember Chris Karol calling you a kook ?

I enjoyed the movie and led me to checking out Ron Paul and a bunch of other stuff after getting fired up watching the movie. I didn't cry, I got pretty pissed.

http://www.bomberonline.com/VBulletin/showthread.php?t=16795&page=3&highlight=zeitgeist

[D-Sub]

ment is running in way that breeds these conspiracy theories because it's so secretive and that there is such widespread corruption that even sane people are starting to suspect everything.

Nothing new...just more information for people to go on. Good point though...it's gotten so bad that you have more and more ship jumpers and whistleblowers.

[Jack M]

I'm trying not to pay attention to this race until next year, but did I hear correctly that Ron Paul is really a mostly-Libertarian infiltrator? If so, I'm in.

[Jon Dahl]

Well, first of all, not all conspiracies are tight knit, some are usually a loosely knit soft conspiacy. Start with the IRC and the current state of taxes in our country. I have recently read a good book called "Cracking the Code". In it, the author correctly tells you two things, 1st the IRS code is completely constitutional, and IF you owe taxes you must pay them, 2nd he shows you how the IRC is wrongly applied to most people, how the code, and court decisions tell you that you need to know if you are, or are not, a "taxpayer", and how the definitions in the code itself suprisingly define that term. Also of note is this: the IRC code is based on strict legal terms, using words that mean only one thing in the code, not how they are used in the general sense out here in the world. This legal principle is summed up like this: the inclusion of one is the exclusion of all others.

Having only seen the poster for the movie mentioned( I will get around to watching it) I can roughly conclude that Zeitgeist is wrong about taxation in America. I have seen a post online someplace about a person serving time in Ft. Dix for tax evasion. After reading the book, and seeing how he ended up there, I have to conclude this: Because he refused to pay taxes on his military pension, he was rightfully incarcerated because his "income" came from a Federal source, the exercise of privelige, a government job, as an "employee". I, on the other hand, work in the private sector, in a common trade, and my reciepts are outside of the reach of the tax sceme. Yet, my employer (in the common usage, not in the codes usage) has me tied into this system. There are ways to extract myself, my unlawfully withheld taxes, from it. You gotta read the book, it would take too long, and my finger is getting tired!

Now, onto religion. One of the "fathers' of modern spiritualism (de Chardin if I remember correctly, the hero of the UN) made an interesting statement. He said that for the world to survive, everyone would have to lay aside spiritual differences to do this. For a new world order, everyone would have to have a "Christ that would satisfy them all". That would mean a Christ who would not offend Muslim, Buddist, Hare Chrishna, Catholic, Protestant, Animist, Spiritualist, et al. Thus the UN's "spiritual" thrust, the World council of Churches inclusiveness of everthing, the reaching out of ALMOST all of Protestantism to Rome as the mother church, the overtly invasion of spiritualism in most churches of our day. Funny how the church I belong to warned of this very thing over 150 years ago, has been mocked for it, yet the religious headlines of today read like everything that has been warned about in the past, as present truth. Am I sceptical of the grand majority of "religions" out there? Yes! Why? They all (protestant, catholic) ignore the Bible, and value traditions above Scripture. Jesus said " In vain do they worship me, teaching as commandment the traditions of man". I am willing to discuss theology offline with anyone, so I will cut this off here. Just think for yourselves, if you are Christian, read your Bible, use your brain, you will see for yourself.

By the way, my thinking is probably way too radical for most of my brothers and sisters in Christ. But I do have hope for them, that they will see the abuses of power done in the name of freedom, but really done to create, as one motto of a particular secret order says, "out of chaos, order".

I hope I didn't offend anyone, but I had to be offended to get to the point that I would see my personal condition, so, who knows?

[D-Sub]

I'm trying not to pay attention to this race until next year, but did I hear correctly that Ron Paul is really a mostly-Libertarian infiltrator? If so, I'm in.

He's definitely libertarian, but chose to run on the republican ticket because most idiots equate libertarian with libertine or what is now called liberal.

He won't end up on the ballot, I guarantee it. I'll write him in if he isnt. If he does get elected he will be killed, but at least that will cause a HUGE problem

[Jon Dahl]

Teilhard de Chardin, in his book, "Christianity and Evolution" states "...a general convergence of religions on a universal Christ who satisfies them all; that seems to me the only possible conversion of the world; and the only form in which a religion of the world can be concieved." Sounds like a one world religion for a one world order to me. A blending of them all, yet gutted of any real faith.

On to Freemasons. In "The Grand Design Exposed" John Daniel writes " The truth is, the Jesuits of Rome have perfected Freemasonry to be their most magnificent and effective tool, accomplishing their purposes among Protestants." So, this is how it goes, if you see Freemasonry, look for the Jesuit, who is linked by oath and faith to Rome, the church. He will be doing in secret what Rome wants him to be, diluting protestant faith. Everything else runs from that point. It is public record that Billy Graham was a 33rd degree Freemanson. Was he friendly to Rome? Very! Look at many of the popular televangalists. Many are high level Freemasons. Do what they teach reflect it? Compare what Freemasons teach and what these popular evangalists teach, then see what the Bible actually teaches on those subjects, then YOU decide

[utahcarver]

Though Jon (Dahl's) points are well written and well-documented, I'd like to interrupt and point out the beginning of this thread started with D-Sub wanting us to watch the movie Zeitgeist. I've watched it several times now.

At the beginning of the video, the point is made concerning the American colonies using money that wasn't controlled by the crown. King George III outlawed their money and made the colonists borrow money from the Bank of England (at interest). The colonies were forced to stop using an honest money system and begin using (fiat) money that could be valued or devalued at the whim of the bank or whomever controlled the bank. It was cited that this, among other reasons, was a major cause of the (American) revolution.

It is easy to understand why the colonies rebelled: Their money which is backed by real wealth had been replaced by money which had no backing (worth) other than what the government said that it was worth. It was and is simply madness and indefensible. The colonists wouldn't live with it and put up a fight. Whereas, today we Americans just keep taking it up the tailpipe and bleating like sheep whenever the Fed issues a new edict concerning interest rates. We have the same problem as the colonists had.

But, here we all sit and type about 'who was behind 9-11?' completely forgetting or ignoring that fact. That's why it's so hard for some of you to accept that the US government could have been involved in the attacks. You don't know or accept that history is littered with the debris of corrupted governments who oppressed their own people with fiat money , who fought needless wars to expand empires, and who murdered their own people when needed. It's a pattern that is indigenous to all governments and nations.

The American colonists understood history enough to know when to fight their own government. They refused to be used as chattel and then burned as refuse when the Crown was done with them. I wish the same could be said of us. The churches and the government schools of today have kept the populace docile and sleepy. The pulpits of churches used to be filled with preachers who spoke out against corrupt government officials. Now, we get pacifist preachers and 'for your money you will be saved'. Schools used to teach history that was accurate and not watered-down. Now we get Jay Leno asking embarrassingly simple questions on the street that cannot be answered correctly by seemingly adult people.

When people won't even rebel (as their forefathers did) against a dishonest money system, how in the hell is anyone going to get them to believe their own government might have been complicit in the 9-11 attacks?

Mark

"...and they call it paradise. I don't know why." - Eagles