xsport652 Posted February 13, 2007 Report Share Posted February 13, 2007 Is There such a thing? Or is there some sort of insert I can stick in there or even build myself? I just bought a pair of salomon F24's which are from what I am told the 2nd stiffest soft boot salomon makes next to the malamute. After 2 days of riding they are broken in and have lost all their stiffness. If it helps here are some shots riding just to show you. These prob won't help but whatever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtslalom Posted February 13, 2007 Report Share Posted February 13, 2007 I'm surprised that your boots have lost their stiffness only after 2 days. I have a pair of Burton soft boots and have ridden them for about 20 days. They are still as stiff as the day I bought them. They have a stiffness rating of 7 out of 10. I would bring those boots back to where you bought them and ask for a new pair. As for a liner that stiffens your boots, I haven't heard of such a thing although I'm sure there is something out there. You may want to try hard boots if you are so concerned with boot stiffness. There aren't many soft boots (if at all) that will give the ridity and stiffness of a hard boot. My advice would be to buy used hard bindings and boots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nekdut Posted February 13, 2007 Report Share Posted February 13, 2007 Booster Straps would help a bit. Also, what binding are you using? Overall stiffness will depend on the quality of that interface as well. If you have a lockable highback, attaching the booster strap to that will add a lot of toeside stiffness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave* Posted February 13, 2007 Report Share Posted February 13, 2007 Try an old Raichle ski boot tongue ( sorry dont know model ) or a Raichle/deeluxe Hardboot (SB series) tongue under the laces and above the soft boots tongue, the compound curve of the plastic tongue will stiffen your soft boot in a Fore/Aft as well as in the lateral plane considerably. Doesnt work overly well with Flow bindings, regular strappers might need the straps let out a touch. It does add an extra minute to the morning lace up ritual. This was my last step before going to HBs a few years back. This is a thought, if you had access to some Kydex ( thermoplastic sheet, commonly used in making knife sheaths nowadays) you could mold your own stiffeners, its pretty easy stuff to work with, only need oven and hand tools. I have come up with hundreds of uses for this stuff. I guess you could order some SB series tongues from bomber as well. Dave* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackbird Posted February 13, 2007 Report Share Posted February 13, 2007 That's why Burton Softies are so good... They come with the inserts for the tongue to stiffen them up... "RAF" rider adjustable flex.. I ride SL-8's and they are the most comfortable boot and quite stiff too... insert the RAF and it just goes up to the next level.... but nowhere near hardboots.... maybe something to think about if you wanna take the plunge. Definitely get some of these made up to insert into the boot tongue....or take yours back and complain..... they shouldn't soften up that much after only a couple of days riding..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr D Posted February 14, 2007 Report Share Posted February 14, 2007 I did see a boot and sorry I forget the brand that had removable strips of plastic that went into the tongue and shell to control stiffness in various areas. I assume that like myself you enjoy carving in soft boots so I will spare the hard boot lecture. I use two band booster straps with good results. I would also recomend the plastic tongue trick mentioned above. I have gone to thermomold inserts with great success so if your boot has inserts you can trade them out for others that are stiffer. I have looked at Zipfit liners that lace up prior to inserting them that look promising but haven't tried them. they make a sleeve that goes over your liner and laces up that is designed to give support andtake up room in a boot that is to big. I think 1/2 size or so. Its worth a shot. on another note I find that with really forward angles (65//60) a little heel slop is a good thing. weird I know, but it forces you to use your rear leg forefoot to control your toeside edges and give it kind of a tele feel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martyagt4 Posted February 14, 2007 Report Share Posted February 14, 2007 I have gone to thermomold inserts with great success so if your boot has inserts you can trade them out for others........ Curious what liners you tried. I stuffed my Deeluxe liners into my soft boots the other day and they were significantly softer in forward lean than the stockers. My soft boots are Flow Zone with BOA laces. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonerider Posted February 14, 2007 Report Share Posted February 14, 2007 I think Dr.D is refering to Deeluxe TPS softboot which hasd spark(?) sticks that you could add in. Some Burton boots and ThirtyTwo boots come with a plastic tongue insert to stiffen up your boot. Thermoflex/Intuition liners for alpine/ski boots (ThirtyTwo softboots have a dual/tri-density Intuition liner) are actually really soft and rely on the stiffness of the shell to keep their shape. Even foam liners like Zipfit and Daibello require a rather stiff shell. In the past 7 years, I've ridden the Salomon Dialogue (2 pairs), Synapse, and Malamute boots and they all seem to have liner durability issues (pack out and break down really easily). I just got a pair of Nitro Team boots and the liners have a *wicked* amount of contour under the calf and above the ankle - very good for someone who has incredibly narrow ankles and gets really bad heel lift (the Salomon were ok, once I added from foam around the ankles) Still need to ride the Nitros but thought I'd give you a heads up (on sale at backcountryoutlet.com) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr D Posted February 14, 2007 Report Share Posted February 14, 2007 Curious what liners you tried. I stuffed my Deeluxe liners into my soft boots the other day and they were significantly softer in forward lean than the stockers. My soft boots are Flow Zone with BOA laces. the thinner double wrap styles that can be found in vans or heelside work although they work better if there is an inner lace system in your boots already. I also found it helpful to add a butterfly to the outside of the liner to help with the heel cup. It is important to remember that you won't be leaning on the tongue successfully anyway, they are soft boots after all. So you have to focus on driving your weight into the board rather than into the boot cuffs if that makes sense. fantastic angulation by the way really good for a pair of soft boots. play with your angles and you will find that you learn something from each change that is applicable to all. I run a vans boot that has an internal hardback with adjustable forward lean. they may not be as stiff but I have control inside the boot rather than in the bindings. I use Ntype switch boots which aren't made anymore but you can find them on the bay. you could run the nype boot in a standard binding as well by removing the bail from the bottom of the boot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martyagt4 Posted February 14, 2007 Report Share Posted February 14, 2007 the thinner double wrap styles that can be found in vans or heelside work although they work better if there is an inner lace system in your boots already. I also found it helpful to add a butterfly to the outside of the liner to help with the heel cup. It is important to remember that you won't be leaning on the tongue successfully anyway, they are soft boots after all. So you have to focus on driving your weight into the board rather than into the boot cuffs if that makes sense. Hmm, I was hoping for a solution that would make the boot slighty more comfortable. I really dig the current soft boots I have. The tounge has a nice thick plastic outer and the stainless wire crossing over from the BOA lace makes a huge difference in stiffness for me. I was dissapointed with the molded liners. I suppose I'll make do with what I have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr D Posted February 14, 2007 Report Share Posted February 14, 2007 see edit above I run soft boots a lot for the comfort so I understand what you are saying. the thin liners don't lack in comfort if they are molded properly. the butterflies can help add to heel cup comfort. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest needanswer Posted February 15, 2007 Report Share Posted February 15, 2007 DR D what are the butterfiles you're talking about? what does it look like ? where can you buy it? is there a brand? what's it for? are you running 65/60 in softies? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dragon fly jones Posted February 15, 2007 Report Share Posted February 15, 2007 It is a a foam piece that is shaped like a butterfly that has adhesive on one side that can be attached to the outside of the liner to further customize the fit. Most ski shops have them in stock and I imagine would be willing to give you one or attach one. If your in the Denver area I have several and we can make arrangements to assit you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr D Posted February 15, 2007 Report Share Posted February 15, 2007 DR D what are the butterfiles you're talking about? what does it look like ? where can you buy it? is there a brand? what's it for? are you running 65/60 in softies? tognar makes a horseshoe shaped one but I like the butterfly shaped ones the best. they are a 4-5mm thick piece of foam that has adhesive on one side that you stick to the outside of your liner to help form a heel cup. they really work better if you use contact cement once you know you like the feel and are sure you want to keep them on. the adhesive on them isn't that great. yes I have been running angles as high as 65/60 with softies depending on the board. IF you get inside the edges to far you really lose fine control fast. I generally run them as far forward as I can and still have the toe and heel of the boot just touching the edge. far enough in to avoid boot out but not so far as to lose edge control. I am running vans n-type boots and switch bindings with a lift plate which also helps with leverage and lessens boot out issues. I will post a pic when I get one taken. Today I ran my gaarage board and the angles worked out to 54/48 The F2 speedcross I just sold ran well at 63/57. I know its not possible but that's half the fun:biggthump IT requires being very low and lots of knee bending. I concentrate on pressuring the ball and toes of my back foot on toeside turns with increased pressure through the turn. I find that a little heel slop in the back foot is helpful. strange but true heelsides I just shift my hips and weight laterally into the boots which would translate into forward on the board I guess!? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest needanswer Posted February 16, 2007 Report Share Posted February 16, 2007 It is a a foam piece that is shaped like a butterfly that has adhesive on one side that can be attached to the outside of the liner to further customize the fit. Most ski shops have them in stock and I imagine would be willing to give you one or attach one. If your in the Denver area I have several and we can make arrangements to assit you. thanks but I'm in the california. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xsport652 Posted February 18, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 18, 2007 Thanks for the suggestions guys. The easiest thing would probably be just to put a booster strap on my bindings somehow but they are not locking. The bindings are Rome Targas 06-07 version. Or I don't know if these would work to put in my current salmon F24 boots or not? http://www.bomberonline.com/store/boots/acc_af_race_kits.cfm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xsport652 Posted February 18, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 18, 2007 actually i am a little confused with the booster strap situation. could someone explain to me exactly what they are and what they do? Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest needanswer Posted February 19, 2007 Report Share Posted February 19, 2007 If you're riding strap bindings, you already have one strap on your toes , one on your ankle. If you able to attach the booster strap near the top of the highback on your binding, then it acts as a third strap on your shin. If the binding's highback is locked, and the strap is wrapped around your boot at the top, any movement you make (even laterally) would translate to the binding and then to the board. since the boot is completely attached to the binding (top,ankle,and toe), the boot becomes as stiff as the binding. The caveat is that the strap is elastic, so it's not completely stiff. Hope that's what you were asking. actually i am a little confused with the booster strap situation. could someone explain to me exactly what they are and what they do?Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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