Do you grease the threads on your TD2 bolts?

[Steve Dold]

Many people think it softens the material around the inserts in at least some brands of boards. I didn't think it was a problem before, but I finally did notice it in a board that I used locktite on.

[paappraiser]

Ive been using locktit for years no problem.....

Fin ? Fin? What do you say here on what should be done?

I cant get into greasing a bolt... but then, my mechanic lightly greases the bolts on my tires before installing them. (waterproof grease) ... they have never come of in all the years I have been going to him.

[Derf]

I don't thnik Loctite is a problem with metal, but I've seen it eat through the 3D disks on my first generation Burton Freestyle bindings. I posted a picture a few years ago on the forum, but I don't know where the disks are right now.

[peter_x]

I don't understand this concept of "false torque"

In my mind, the only thing that applying grease to the heads does is transfer the friction from there to the threads. Possibly, for other reasons, it matters where this friction is. But friction is friction.

So why do you torque a bolt less/more when you have applied grease?

[Steve Dold]

As a bolt becomes tight, the majority of effort turning the wrench is in overcoming head and thread friction. In one engine book I have, it says that for a given torque, about 50% of the friction (when nearly tight) is from the head friction, 40 is from the thread friction, and 10% is from the inclined-plane effect that is putting the actual tension into the bolt. If you lube the threads and/or head, and put the same force (torque) on the bolt, more of the torque tranlates into tension on the bolt, and you might exceed the yield point.

When a company says "Torque to X in-pounds" they specify what lube, if any, should be used because it changes the amount of torque that should be applied to get the right tension, which is what really matters. Torque is only used because there is no easy way to measure tension.

[MUD]

Howdy,

I would say get in touch with Bomber and go with what they suggest. They have done a bit of testing and know these bindings better than anyone. Fin is VERY good at replying to e-mails.

I am not going to post anything I can't back-up with data. (yes, I am an engineer)

If you would like to research it, here is a good source; Engineers edge.

As far as Loc-tite, they make TONS of versions. They make some for composites, it is just hard to get.

If one is going to post that something is "well documented", please provide a link to this documentation.

[roman]

all i do is adding a drop blue loctite to the threads only. never became a loose screw or even loosed one:biggthump. btw, i use phiokka/virus freeflex plates.

[Steve Dold]

Thanks for the link, MUD. The site gives an interesting equation: T=.2DF, where T=torque (in-pounds), D=bolt diameter, F=tension desired in pounds. Thread pitch isn't even even mentioned. Is this because the inclined-plane action of the threads is nearly insignificant compared to thread and head friction? MUD, if you have some insight, we would welcome it. We will not ask you to post anything that you cannot back up with data :)

If one is going to post that something is "well documented", please provide a link to this documentation.

Here's where I found the 50/40/10% ratio: Sacramento Skyranch engineering manual, http://www.sacskyranch.com/pubsem.htm

[MUD]

Thanks for the link, MUD. The site gives an interesting equation: T=.2DF, where T=torque (in-pounds), D=bolt diameter, F=tension desired in pounds. Thread pitch isn't even even mentioned. Is this because the inclined-plane action of the threads is nearly insignificant compared to thread and head friction? MUD, if you have some insight, we would welcome it. We will not ask you to post anything that you cannot back up with data :)

Here's where I found the 50/40/10% ratio: Sacramento Skyranch engineering manual, http://www.sacskyranch.com/pubsem.htm

Hey Steve,

That is an interesting question....... I have to think about it a little, but I think your thought is correct. They have oversimplified that equation a little if you ask me. But in practice, it's probably all you need. In most of my reading fine threads are stronger due to the higher cross sectional area, as seen here.

But that is about it. They have other qualities, but they a mute here.

My comment about backing up what you say was actually more directed at JLH, he made some off the cuff comment about Loc-tite, which I would like to see that data on.

NICE LINK!!! That's a cool one. It's always great to find these. Take a look around the EE site, it has some great materials based info as well.

[C5 Golfer]

The logical side of me says if you want your screws to loosen after a day or two of riding then grease the threads of the bolts, if you want them to stay tightened for the season then leave them dry.

Also, same logic applies to lug bolts or nuts that hold the wheels on your car, with that, I hope you do not grease the threads or the mating surfaces of those fasteners. But check your owners manual, I bet they say "no lube"

Discount Tire Installation guide , item #6 says specifically "do not Lube"

[Phil]

The logical side of me says if you want your screws to loosen after a day or two of riding then grease the threads of the bolts, if you want them to stay tightened for the season then leave them dry.

I've been doing it for years and have only had my bolts come loose once (anomoly?). In fact, I have assembled and serviced bikes this way for years as well. I have never had a problem. It is also a lot cheaper than using loctite.

I don't know if it has been mentioned (too lazy to go back), but using Loctite will void the warranty on some boards.

[Dr D]

I love this stuff man:biggthump

This is where new ideas happen!

And old ones over and over. I will go with the manufacturers "Enginmaneer" on this one. Torqueing wood to spec never made sense to me anyway. Some sort of antiseize is a given, at least to any body who has ever done maintainance on military gear with aluminum parts. gallons of that nasty black goo are gone thru daily. I think its petroleum jelly saturated with moly and its impossible to get it off of you after.

bomber butter is better:1luvu: :1luvu: