Carving the crowds -- meaty slalom gates...

[Bullwings]

i did some searching on crowds, but didn't get past the 4th or 5th page.

i've watched TONS of carving videos now (something like 30+ files in my snowboarding videos folder) and practically all of the videos are on slopes with hardly another person in sight. The majority of the videos are also very early in the day, and on groomed runs. That's all nice and great for the first 1-2 hours of the day (if you're lucky), but what do you do with the remaining 3-4 hours (or 6-7 at some places)?

I've never been to the east coast, so i don't know what crowds look like there, but if anyone has been to Snow Summit or Mt. High in SoCal, now would be a great time to chime in. I try to go to mammoth whenever i can, but that isn't something i can do every weekend.

Most of those videos show the riders carving across the whole run perpendicular to the fall line. It doesn't exactly seem feasible to be doing this throughout the whole day with a bunch of people just sitting on their asses. The only exception to this, were some of the sequences in the hard attack video (there were some resort sequences there, but those crowds were very mild, and not a crowd at all by my definition). Carving back UP the mountain seems like suicide too...

So down to my question, what board, techniques, etc. etc. do you apply when dealing with crowds? Oh, and we all have different ideas of what "crowds" are, so if anyone has pictures available to post, that would be awesome so we can compare notes...

[Dan]

Pick a lane, about 10-15 feet wide, and carve regular turns from side to side of that lane. Deviate from that line only to overtake people below you.

If you're an intermediate to advanced carver and riding fairly fast, not that many people will be passing you, and you may be able to use a wider lane. I.e., even with bigger turns/wider lane you're still going faster than most people on the mountain.

[DiveBomber]

Just pretened todlers are moving gates

[Guest]

I find it's all about looking ahead. Are you going to make symmetrical turns? No. But such is the price for riding crowded slopes. Go fast enough and you won't have to worry about anyone overtaking you. It takes practice and experience, but as long as you are mindful of everyone on the trail, you'll be fine.

[trikerdad]

'Straightliners', both snowboarders and skiers, are what send me home early. I have no problem carving around the human obstacles below me but, hate the ones that are nowhere to be seen when I check up the hill then go flying by me 5 seconds later. I've been hit, and had too many near misses, by the idiots that bomb straight down the hill. I try to be on the mountain and ride my favorite steeper runs when the lifts open then, when the staightliners scare me off, I move to the green runs where there are a lot of slow people but not many crazies.

[AaronG]

I carve regularly at Snow Summit but I do most of my carving during the week. Weekends just get too crazy there. You just need to hang out where the general public doesn't go, at Summit that is Chair 7 and 10. Gdboytyler and I have had some great carving sessions there. It helps that Summit has moved most of their rails, boxes and other slope litter over to Bear Mtn.

If I do elect to go on the weekends, usually it is for a night session and the slopes clear out after 6:00 pm.

You do have to occasionally look out for the out of control or straightline rider but I have had no collisions with others there. Mammoth on the other hand, I have more than my share of near misses.

[Tommy D]

I'm of the same mind as TrikerDad.

I get out there early and carve as much as I can on the steeper stuff, but then when all the yahoos come out, I move to wider and flatter stuff.

Some days crowds are almost impossible to avoid, so I usually wait for a gap, and start carving hard... frequently, most folks stop to watch, but I'll check up hill every other toeside to make sure I'm not about to be run over.

Symetrical, predictable turns in a tight corridor as Dan suggests is also a great defense. Or, if you are lucky, have some skier friends ski uphill of you as blockers!

But when the slopes get too crowded for carving, I switch to my skis and hit the bumps/trees.

[Neil Gendzwill]

When it's crowded, you can't commit to those big carves. Keep your pace up so you're overtaking, but not too fast, and look uphill if you're going to come across hard. Watch out for those snowplowers, they change direction randomly and instantly.

[paappraiser]

Just pretened todlers are moving gates

hahahahah

Rule #1 when you are carving during busy times....

Stay AT LEAST 15 Feet from the edge of the trail.. I 100% promise you will have someone try to pass you at the edge and hit you...

[Bullwings]

Watch out for those snowplowers, they change direction randomly and instantly.

I've had a collision with one of those on a blue-black run. I wasn't exactly carving that time around, I was mostly straight lining it down a slope that looked like no one was on it. Damn heelside blind spots (especially at lower angles).

I'm not too worried about people coming from behind me as much. It's the people in front of me that I can see that scare me. There's the snowplowers, the wall makers (snowplowers that stop out of nowhere and sit down -- they like to do this in groups too, thereby narrowing the run by 25-40%), and the people that eat $hit in front of you begging you to decapitate them with your board... This is what tends to make the flatter stuff more dangerous.

hey, oldvolvos, what's the SCR on the boards you use at Snow Summit in crowds? i'm thinking a 19m SCR isn't exactly gonna cut it (not that i have one that large. 11.2 is the largest i have). Oh yeah, and definitely Snow Summit >>> Bear Mt. I've never seen as much park crap all over the place as i have at Bear Mt. That place is more than 60% park.

[willywhit]

Just pretened todlers are moving gates

I cringe to think of colliding with anyone at speed, it's just plain reckless to rip turns through a crowd. Too many close calls have "tempered" my speed and carving through the masses. Having dano take me out at speed is one thing, colliding with a kid scares me BIGTIME.

...and someone needs remedial spelling lessons

[Allee]

I'm not too worried about people coming from behind me as much. It's the people in front of me that I can see that scare me. There's the snowplowers, the wall makers (snowplowers that stop out of nowhere and sit down -- they like to do this in groups too, thereby narrowing the run by 25-40%), and the people that eat $hit in front of you begging you to decapitate them with your board... This is what tends to make the flatter stuff more dangerous.

That's absolutely true, but when you're an advanced rider ripping through a beginner area and you hit somebody, you know that you're going to be carrying the can - and maybe rightfully so. For this reason, I always chill in green areas. Beginners can't get out of my way, so I try and stay out of theirs. They don't think ahead, so I try and do it for them. They are going to fall in front of you ... get over it.

That was you, once.

[Neil Gendzwill]

Yup. You'll find that you won't get a lot of sympathy around here for being the uphill rider in a collision.

[Guest stoked]

definitely I don't like riding through the crowds at high speed like some alpine riders and a lot of skiers do so I just make tighter turns compromising some fun or and often that's the case I do wait and enjoy the landscape so that even on crowded days I can use a gap in the crowd for wide turns and this gap that I wait for gotta also and especially be a gap on the slope above me

well had a worst case scenario on a totally not crowded slope last run and I really waited for EVERYONE gone I think the lift had already stopped operating while I was sitting there looked up long sight no one there started wide turns on a narrow steep hill and after about 3 turns or not even close to 10 seconds out of the corner of my eye I see something and immediatly stop the turn get off edge to break and in the about a meter or 3 feet remaining between myself and the edge of the slope comes a skier through at mach 5 straight downhill and nothing happened but this was the scariest experience - if I hadn't stopped the turn we would have either collided or he would have to have gone off trail falling or flying down a little cliff to crash into trees at the bottom either way he or both of us could have whatever

and not to mention I did the most predictable turns I mean probably that guy thought it would be cool to pass me close and was then surprised that this all of a sudden became a not so potentially funny situation

[paappraiser]

I just have to say... parents stick with your kids..... I know its hard..

I watched a little girl get wacked by a snowboarder.. No parents anywhere, I ran up and made shure she was ok.. about 10 min later parents show up.

Girl was scared mostly... (screamming "I wanna go potty" by the time the parents show up)...

im Just venting...

[DiveBomber]

Basically you just have to watch out for EVERYBODY, Ive been right next to people and had them turn into me, with out even looking first.

but thats why I NEVER go on the weekends, But when you get on the lower sections where it starts to funnel everyone together, Just try and keep your didstance from anyone 15ft is good, you never know when the person in front of you is going to do something un expected. Most bigginers that youll find on the lower sections are just trying to stay upright and arent paying attention to much else

[FTA2R]

frequently a real issue at my local hills. especiall frustrating to see the clueless (at least newbs have an excuse) just sitting in slopes, in essence, stationary human gates. i suppose that's somewhat better than a lot of moving people??

i've had collissions (nothing major, but at fair speed) and t-boned a kid who was coming down hill (he was uphill) and chipped part of my Donek (luckily it was easily repaired). no doubt about it, we have to really be paying attention. i think it's one of the golden rules in Carver's Almanac. i'll sit on the side of a slope upwards of a minute sometimes if it means i'll have the slope to myself. on the other hand, riding in crowds forces me to work on tighter turning and looking ahead. just like so many other activities, gotta watch out for "the other guy" and a great reason to wear a helmet. some of the real long boards i think would be suicidal on some hills here, even the blue ones- theyr'e just too crowded.

with all the bikers here, i imagine having a keen sense of your surroundings is nothing new. easier said than done, sometimes, of course.

[willywhit]

and not to mention I did the most predictable turns I mean probably that guy thought it would be cool to pass me close and was then surprised that this all of a sudden became a not so potentially funny situation

or the kids that come tearing out of the woods onto a trail without looking.

I've literally PUSHED people down to avoid a full impact collision, sounds harsh but getting clocked by a 230 pound guy going 30 mph is no joke.

and like Barry said, people that want to over take you at speed(usually hack skiiers) way too close are idiots.Most want to show the fast snowboarder that they're even faster.

anyone care to mention how jake burton got taken out(broken leg) by a skiier on the top of Gondelier at Stowe ? I met the skiier that did it.

[RDY_2_Carve]

Just come to NM and you guys won't have these over-crowding problems!

[DiveBomber]

Just come to NM and you guys won't have these over-crowding problems!

let do Taos , its been a LOOoong time But i kind of liked ski santa fe, Might have to try angel fire

[RDY_2_Carve]

let do Taos , its been a LOOoong time But i kind of liked ski santa fe, Might have to try angel fire

Ski Santa Fe is the best place to carve so far for me....and that includes some "big name" resorts in CO. I won't name them for fear of being assassinated.

[DiveBomber]

Ski Santa Fe is the best place to carve so far for me....and that includes some "big name" resorts in CO. I won't name them for fear of being assassinated.

Nah.... go ahead "we name names!" (ala Seinfeld Hop Sings)

[paappraiser]

. some of the real long boards i think would be suicidal on some hills here, even the blue ones- theyr'e just too crowded.

where are you riding in DC?

[carvedog]

i've had collissions (nothing major, but at fair speed) and t-boned a kid who was coming down hill (he was uphill) and chipped part of my Donek (luckily it was easily repaired). no doubt about it, we have to really be paying attention.

How can you Tbone a kid who is uphill from you? If he hit you he would be the Tboner and you would be the Tboneee.

And vice versa.

[Bullwings]

some of the real long boards i think would be suicidal on some hills here, even the blue ones- theyr'e just too crowded.

those 200cm+ boards that i've seen on the Donek page with 18-19.5m SCR come to mind. Those just seem suicidal on anything but a designated closed run for racing.

damn crowds... looks like the learning curve on HBs just got higher for me. ah well, on a brighter note, they just started blowing the artificial crap at the locals.

as far as crowds go, i prefer the sitters. at least you know where they're going to be for the next 20-30 seconds. it's a lot easier to plan out your line around them than it is planning your line around erratic, unpredictable "falling leaf syndrome" snowboarders.

i'm not worried about skiers at all. i'm in SoCal... snowboarding is the trendy/hip/in thing to be doing. most chicks (and yes, women, females for this for this part of the world -- and chicks, because they're all under 21 for the most part) are more concerned with looking good/cool (appearance wise -- not skills). they'd rather flail around clumsily on a snowboard and just sit on the slopes posing than be on skis where they might actually make it down the slope in less than an hour.