Termin8tor Posted December 6, 2018 Report Share Posted December 6, 2018 I’m in.... 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauleleven Posted December 7, 2018 Report Share Posted December 7, 2018 14 hours ago, SunSurfer said: Boiler & SG plates, and any similar fixed axle + sliding axle design will allow any reasonable chord depth to freely form as the board bends. Revise your geometry of chords, sagittae and arcs and their relationship to get your head round this. What this discussion would really benefit from is someone making a video of an AllFlex plate being bench tested as the board is flexed beneath it. Thinking about these sliding axle designs, there’s only so much space available for the axle to slide tho..... Im just thinking, if the board flexes to the point where the axle is stopped by the slide, that’d be..... very unpleasent See if people can make videos about all of these different plates flexing, I understand the boiler and sg are both super rigid carbon plates? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SunSurfer Posted December 7, 2018 Report Share Posted December 7, 2018 (edited) @pauleleven as I said above. You need to revise the geometry of chords(the plate) arcs (the snowboard) and sagittae (the max distance between board and plate when the board is flexed). What you will learn is how little slide is needed to make quite a large gap, and therefore a curve in the snowboard that has a relatively small radius. I did all this math a long time ago when I built my own sliding axle plate around the time of the 2010 Vancouver Winter Olympics. I also own a Bomber Boiler plate and have bench tested and observed what happens as the board is flexed. The most powerful argument that can be made is from you doing the math yourself. Edited December 7, 2018 by SunSurfer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauleleven Posted December 8, 2018 Report Share Posted December 8, 2018 17 hours ago, SunSurfer said: @pauleleven as I said above. You need to revise the geometry of chords(the plate) arcs (the snowboard) and sagittae (the max distance between board and plate when the board is flexed). What you will learn is how little slide is needed to make quite a large gap, and therefore a curve in the snowboard that has a relatively small radius. I did all this math a long time ago when I built my own sliding axle plate around the time of the 2010 Vancouver Winter Olympics. I also own a Bomber Boiler plate and have bench tested and observed what happens as the board is flexed. The most powerful argument that can be made is from you doing the math yourself. Just did my numbers: so if distance becomes 10mm, you only need like 0.45 mm of travel on the slide probably should define arclength to get max flex distance then we can take this and combine it with the Physics of a carve figure out the highest angulation without hitting the limit lol so if this is the case, Allflex’s 6.4mm travel would most certainly mean that the plate is designed to flex with the board, probably dont even have the spike once travel runs out, maybe somewhere along the bend travel the plate also starts flexing so you have a smooth pressure increase? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigwavedave Posted December 15, 2018 Report Share Posted December 15, 2018 Does this view help? One of many at the RTTC (PSL) at Buck Hill, MN today. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveo Posted December 15, 2018 Report Share Posted December 15, 2018 I will buy an allflex spring plate next season and compare it to my vistflex I got from the man the myth the legend @pokkis. Anyone is welcome to try both of them if you make your way near me (either Japan or Korea), all of Feb. The vistflex front and rear hinges are connected to the board's allflex inserts by sliders and the middle allflex inserts are connected to two posts which limit travel of the board and then bend the vistflex. This can be adjusted to give more or less flex depending on preference slash application. Apparently using metal and plastic in conjunction with each other, is a good thing for some vibration reason(?). I'm not a materials engineer so I know nuffin about that. On 12/9/2018 at 12:27 AM, pauleleven said: Erm sorry I think this might be the lecturer coming out in me, so just ignore me. But, I think this is based on the assumption that the flex is consistent throughout the length of the board for which arcL can be calculated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueB Posted December 15, 2018 Report Share Posted December 15, 2018 17 minutes ago, daveo said: Apparently using metal and plastic in conjunction with each other, is a good thing for some vibration reason(?). Dissimilarity of natural frequency. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveo Posted December 15, 2018 Report Share Posted December 15, 2018 1 minute ago, BlueB said: Dissimilarity of natural frequency. Do you know how this adds a benefit? Honestly, I have literally no idea, but would love to learn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueB Posted December 15, 2018 Report Share Posted December 15, 2018 If a material resonates with a vibration, the vibration gets amplified. If the 2 materials have dissimilar natural frequency, they will not resonate with each other and prevent each other from resonating with a vibration. If you ploted a graph, their sine waves wont match, they will partially cancel each other - they'll dampen the system. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveo Posted December 15, 2018 Report Share Posted December 15, 2018 Understood. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowrider Posted December 15, 2018 Report Share Posted December 15, 2018 Grease or a lubricant acts similarly. As usual the more the bling the better. There are many things at play when using a plate but it's important to understand that it's not simply a matter of the mechanics of the slide (as long as it doesn't impede movement) Tolerance's between all moving parts should be minimized and the flex of both plate and board should match the rider. Traits desirable for racing are not the traits one would find comfortable for recreational riding. The use of a plate in less than ideal conditions is the best use of a plate for recreational purposes. In racing anything can give you the edge you need to win perhaps even a rabbit's foot ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveo Posted December 15, 2018 Report Share Posted December 15, 2018 (edited) 36 minutes ago, lowrider said: Grease or a lubricant acts similarly. As usual the more the bling the better. There are many things at play when using a plate but it's important to understand that it's not simply a matter of the mechanics of the slide (as long as it doesn't impede movement) Tolerance's between all moving parts should be minimized and the flex of both plate and board should match the rider. Traits desirable for racing are not the traits one would find comfortable for recreational riding. The use of a plate in less than ideal conditions is the best use of a plate for recreational purposes. In racing anything can give you the edge you need to win perhaps even a rabbit's foot ! It's definitely personal preference. Edited December 15, 2018 by daveo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beckmann AG Posted December 15, 2018 Report Share Posted December 15, 2018 On 12/7/2018 at 2:36 PM, SunSurfer said: You need to revise the geometry of chords(the plate) arcs (the snowboard) and sagittae Bonus points awarded for subtle Star Wars reference. 5 hours ago, daveo said: It's definitely personal preference. It's definitely a filter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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